Chuck D on Rap & NBA’s Evolution + Favorite Max Memories | Cedric Maxwell Podcast - video Dailymotion

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Cedric Maxwell and Josue Pavon are joined by Chuck D of Public Enemy, a legendary rapper and producer who is a lifelong Knicks fan. They discuss the evolution of the NBA, modern hip hop culture, and reflect on some of Cedric Maxwell's highlights as a player.    Prize Picks! Get in on the excitement with PrizePicks, America’s No. 1 Fantasy Sports App, where you can turn your hoops knowledge into serious cash. Download the app today and use code CLNS for a first deposit match up to $100! Pick more. Pick less. It’s that Easy! Go to https://PrizePicks.com/CLNS  Gametime! Take the guesswork out of buying NBA tickets with Gametime. Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code CLNS for $20 off your first purchase. Download Gametime today. Last minute tickets. Lowest Price. Guaranteed. Terms apply. Go to https://gametime.co !  Elevate your style game on and off the course with the PXG Spring Summer 2024 collection. Head over to https://PXG.com/GARDENREPORT and save 10% on all apparel.  Nutrafol Men! Take the first step to visibly thicker, healthier hair. For a limited time, Nutrafol is offering our listeners ten dollars off your first month’s subscription and free shipping when you go to https://Nutrafol.com/MEN and enter the promo code GARDEN!   #celtics #NBA #BostonCeltics The CLNS Media Network is the leading provider for video/audio content. CLNS is a fully credentialed member of the media with access to all NFL/NBA/NHL/MLB teams & venues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------  CLNS' rebuilt their YouTube community in less than 12 months, during a pandemic that attacked sports. Wondering how? Find out here (and support our channel) - https://www.tubebuddy.com/clnsmedia  Visit the Official Home of CLNS Sports Coverage -  https://clnsmedia.com  Twitter -   / clnsmedia   Celtics -   / celticsclns   Patriots -   / patriotsclns   Bruins -   / bruinsclns   Red Sox -   / redsoxclns   Non-Sports -   / northstation   Facebook -   / clnsmedia   INSTA -   / clnsmedia   INSTA Celtics -   / celticsclns   INSTA History -   / nbahistoryclns

Transcript

00:00:00Cedric Maxwell podcast is powered by Price Picks, the exclusive daily fantasy partner of the CLNS media network.

00:00:19It's another NBA finals edition of the Cedric Maxwell podcast.

00:00:22And like we said, we have a very, very special guest lined up today.

00:00:27Man, hip hop legend, producer, rapper.

00:00:30He gave you one of the greatest rap groups of all time and public enemy.

00:00:33He's Chuck D. Join the podcast.

00:00:35I'm Joseph Colbone. Cedric Maxwell is here as well.

00:00:38But what's going on, Chuck D, man?

00:00:40Thank you for coming on, man. Appreciate you.

00:00:42Man, I thank y'all for even asking me.

00:00:45And then I got the great cornbread Maxwell.

00:00:49I had to school you the other day those way or how mighty and how much how significant this man was in my high school year.

00:01:01Because I think he was coming out of college.

00:01:03And I was in my last year of high school.

00:01:05And I was telling my boys, watch out for because we used to read the Street and Smiths and the Street and Smiths.

00:01:14It was a basketball magazine back in the day where we used to always kind of always look for the underdog, the sleeper.

00:01:21And at a 1977 NCAAs, this is back in the day with Brian Gumbel was doing the broadcasting.

00:01:29Your man, your man, your man turned up.

00:01:33He turned up and took the whole the whole issue to the last second.

00:01:39So to be actually and also the modern day.

00:01:44Cornbread Maxwell, you know, is somebody I listen to on Sirius XM during the Celtics broadcast.

00:01:50He'd be having me crying.

00:01:52Oh, man, that's how I see growing up.

00:01:54That was that was me, man.

00:01:56The funniest, most entertaining radio broadcast.

00:02:01I'm so I'm so impressed that, you know, a New York guy would write in the magazine and follow me.

00:02:10I always thought that was the coolest thing.

00:02:12And I'm sure it's having you a thousand times where rappers came to you and said, man, I grew up on you, man.

00:02:19I everything you did.

00:02:21I tried to do it.

00:02:22That is the coolest shit of all time.

00:02:24When I hear that for somebody like you, even when they speak other languages.

00:02:29You know, so I take it at a grain of salt, man.

00:02:33We we hear and everything.

00:02:35You know, we like a prism.

00:02:37I tell people, I said, listen, when you when you get to some significance, the light that shine on you, you supposed to be like a prism.

00:02:44That light bounce off into so many area colors as like a spectrum.

00:02:50You distribute the light that comes to you.

00:02:52Man, we can't we can't take anything with us.

00:02:54And and to think that we could get everything is kind of, you know, on a greedy tip.

00:02:58So I'm humbled.

00:03:00But like I said, for years, you've been my hero.

00:03:04One of my heroes and most of my heroes don't appear on the stamp anyway.

00:03:08Before any of y'all know.

00:03:10So when I was asked to be honest, I get asked to be on a lot of shows.

00:03:13A lot of sports shows asked me to be on.

00:03:16And I'm like, yeah, I'm a big fanatic fan.

00:03:18Matter of fact, these are my guys.

00:03:20You know, Nick Fair TV.

00:03:22My man, you know, Stevie, the bad guys will be there on Sirius XM as well as Nick Fair TV.

00:03:28But we ball fans.

00:03:30We ain't casuals.

00:03:32So this year, yeah, we Nick fans.

00:03:35But who don't want Tatum and Brown and company and the underrated Joe Missoula to get it?

00:03:43And, you know, only one you probably feel a little sorry for is if my man down in Memphis now.

00:03:49So other than that, you know, yeah, man, this is something.

00:03:54So, yeah, thank you for being on the show.

00:03:57Now I'm going to ask you a lot of questions too, Max.

00:04:00Like, for example, on that game, Marquette, listen, look the whole sway in the back.

00:04:05Marquette, UNCC.

00:04:07They get the ball to you and you put them ahead.

00:04:12You know?

00:04:14And then all of a sudden they run the play.

00:04:16And then what do you think when Bush leaves throwing?

00:04:19Did you think he had the arm enough to catch Whitehead?

00:04:22And then, you know, Whitehead, you know, seriously.

00:04:25I mean, he found you on that playbook.

00:04:28It did.

00:04:29I mean, there was so many things that happened.

00:04:31I what we want to hear just away.

00:04:33And then Bush Lee, he runs some kind of play.

00:04:36And Bush Lee has he gets in and Al McGuire's looking up and see if you can throw it.

00:04:41And he throws it and I catch the ball.

00:04:44And then what happened is that Jerome Whitehead runs into the back of me.

00:04:49I have never recovered that fast.

00:04:52He ran into the back of me, caught the ball.

00:04:55He was about to dunk it.

00:04:56All in one motion, Joe Sway.

00:04:58I was from that place to this place.

00:05:01And I blocked that shot before it went in.

00:05:04And then the ball was on the rim and he tapped it in.

00:05:07And that's how my college career ended.

00:05:11And it was just weird.

00:05:12Any kind of instant replay.

00:05:15It was like, oh, hell no.

00:05:16That shit doesn't go.

00:05:17But, you know, thank you for reminding me of that.

00:05:20You know, I want to ask you, give me your New York, you know, your New York Knicks top five.

00:05:27Oh, that's a good one.

00:05:29Because you're a Knicks fan.

00:05:30You got to be real with us.

00:05:32And you've been with the Knicks for a while.

00:05:34So give me your top five Knicks plays.

00:05:39Top five Knicks plays easily is Willis Reed, Walt Clyde Frazier, Earl Monroe, Patrick Ewing, Charles Oakley.

00:05:50But it's hard to give a top five because I've been following the Knicks since 1967.

00:05:56So I'm ashamed of you.

00:05:59You ain't going to put Bernard King in there?

00:06:01Of course.

00:06:02Of course.

00:06:03I mean, it's hard for me to make.

00:06:05It's hard for me to make top list, man, because I got to.

00:06:08I can't.

00:06:09I can't make top five.

00:06:10It's like somebody trying to give me a top five rappers.

00:06:14I'm like.

00:06:15Yeah, it's hard, right?

00:06:16It changes.

00:06:17Yeah, it changes over a period of time, man.

00:06:19I mean, to me, you one of my favorite Celtic players to look at.

00:06:24But how many Celtics can we name?

00:06:2630.

00:06:27I mean, yeah, you know, you got, you know, you got Bill Russell.

00:06:30And let me tell you this much.

00:06:34Luca, right?

00:06:37He can't exercise his Byrds rights yet.

00:06:44Because the Byrds rights is being compared to Larry Byrd.

00:06:50Not yet.

00:06:52So the Byrds rights for Luca is just not going to happen right now.

00:06:56But, you know, it's coming.

00:06:58But to think that you could be compared to Larry Byrd and you under 25

00:07:02that's crazy, man.

00:07:04Joe Sway, I got to hit him with what E-40 said to me.

00:07:07I was like, I was like met him and I didn't really know who he was.

00:07:11But I said, nice meeting you.

00:07:12And that nigga told me he said ping pong.

00:07:15I said, what?

00:07:17He said ping pong.

00:07:19I ain't never heard that.

00:07:22Yeah, because E-40 be making up his own words.

00:07:24He be making his own slang.

00:07:26I mean, that's the rapper that he is.

00:07:30I had to tell Max, yo, that's not no slang, man.

00:07:33No one says that just so you know.

00:07:35He makes his own thing.

00:07:37He like Flavor Flav.

00:07:39He makes up his own language, man.

00:07:41And it works for him.

00:07:43It works for him.

00:07:44I mean, E-40 make up a slang and make a song about it.

00:07:48And then 150 million people say it and not know what the hell he talking

00:07:54about.

00:07:56When he told me that, I just like looked at him like,

00:07:59are you serious here?

00:08:00He's a nigga back edge.

00:08:03Yo, Max is looking at me like I'm a translator, man.

00:08:05I'm like, yo, that is not part of the culture, man.

00:08:07I don't know about that one.

00:08:09E-40 makes his own culture, man.

00:08:12Matter of fact, he got that whole Bay Area lock.

00:08:15So when you go up in there, man, it starts in, you know,

00:08:19up in Sausalito, Sacramento, all that stuff.

00:08:22And then that language is what he creates.

00:08:24So yeah, he's one of the greats.

00:08:26Well, tell me about, tell me about your, your, your new Nick here.

00:08:29Your, your, your point.

00:08:31Man.

00:08:32That's right now.

00:08:33Cause he's a bad boy.

00:08:34That's why I can't.

00:08:35That's why, that's why, that's why I can't name a quick top five, man.

00:08:39But you know, growing with my boys, Nick bad TV.

00:08:42Jalen Brunson,

00:08:46when he was turnt up showing all out against Dallas three years ago,

00:08:54I was like, this dude right here is something.

00:08:59And I was saying, as far as the Knicks,

00:09:00I think we've been looking for a point guard for like, I mean,

00:09:04we was jumping up and down with Jeremy Lynn.

00:09:07So, I mean,

00:09:09somebody could just bring the ball up and not get stripped.

00:09:11We were looking for, you know, and when Jalen Brunson,

00:09:15when Nick's got Jalen Brunson, I was like, well,

00:09:17at least he got handles and he won't get stripped.

00:09:20And, and if he don't score, he could, he could pass off.

00:09:23And he is just end up being the, you know, the cat's dream, because

00:09:27in New York,

00:09:29if you don't come in New York with the right headspace,

00:09:32like it's social media before social media ever happened.

00:09:36And you got to go in there and we call it microwave square garden.

00:09:40You could get melted up in there.

00:09:42Or, you know, the old saying, I know Max probably know that.

00:09:45He said, you go there on a greyhound,

00:09:47leave on a stray dog.

00:09:49Right.

00:09:53New York is relentless, man.

00:09:56So I think he had the right temperament,

00:09:59humility,

00:10:01strong parents that also was able to bring it to him.

00:10:05Like, you know, get, don't, don't, you know,

00:10:07don't get beside yourself, you know, and,

00:10:09and all that is a factor on, I think.

00:10:12And plus the skillset, the ability to work,

00:10:14the relationship with Tom Thibodeau,

00:10:16all those things were factors that nobody could predict,

00:10:20but all these things came together in a big bang that,

00:10:23that is exciting to watch.

00:10:25And he has a Nick fan.

00:10:28We celebrate the great moments I celebrate in life.

00:10:32I celebrate not years.

00:10:34I celebrate seconds and minutes and moments, man.

00:10:37You know?

00:10:38I mean,

00:10:39when somebody wants to put years on, you'd be like, man,

00:10:42I got more years behind me than the head.

00:10:44So I'm going to celebrate minutes and seconds and hours.

00:10:47And coincidentally it's,

00:10:49it's been a weird NBA finals because we lost three W's in the span of a

00:10:54week.

00:10:55You know, bill Walton.

00:10:57Yeah.

00:10:58Chet Chet Walker.

00:10:59And it's Jerry West.

00:11:01Jerry West.

00:11:02Yeah.

00:11:03Go figure, go figure.

00:11:04Right.

00:11:05Some icon.

00:11:06All three of them were icons, but you know,

00:11:09you got the logo bill Walton and you got Chet Walker who,

00:11:12who coincidentally is like the NBA was talking about giving,

00:11:16you know, like prostitute.

00:11:18I didn't hear anything said about Chet Walker in one of the games.

00:11:20So.

00:11:21Right.

00:11:22Right.

00:11:23But what do you make of what's,

00:11:24what's going on with the,

00:11:25the narrative surrounding this Boston Southern state?

00:11:27And I'm not just talking about this last week.

00:11:28I'm talking about the entire playoffs, man.

00:11:30It seems like Tatum has sort of been in the forefront of,

00:11:32of criticism in terms of like his scoring and his capabilities and all

00:11:36that.

00:11:37Max and I over here have been doing this podcast saying, you know,

00:11:39what about the squad?

00:11:40I mean,

00:11:41everyone's been sort of doing their part in this run and all of a

00:11:44sudden now they're wanting to win away from winning a title.

00:11:46They're on this winning streak throughout the entire post season.

00:11:48And it's like,

00:11:49now they're getting the attention that they deserve as a team,

00:11:52man,

00:11:53people and fans need to get off that privilege thing, man.

00:11:56If somebody's doing something that's great and you are a fanatic and

00:12:00they're going to win and they 15 and two,

00:12:02I don't want to hear no criticism or what.

00:12:05I mean,

00:12:06that just shows you spoiled and privileged and I don't,

00:12:09you know,

00:12:10me as a fan of a Nick fan,

00:12:11man,

00:12:12I'm telling you,

00:12:13man,

00:12:14I think if we would've got to the Eastern and we were game away from

00:12:17getting to the ECF,

00:12:18man,

00:12:19that would have been like,

00:12:20that would have been a championship for us knowing that we,

00:12:23you know,

00:12:24we depleted,

00:12:25we ain't going to be Boston,

00:12:26but it would be sometimes the game's just gotta be fun,

00:12:29right?

00:12:30It's just gotta be fun,

00:12:31man.

00:12:32As a fan,

00:12:33I wanted that series,

00:12:34Chuck,

00:12:35man.

00:12:36I wanted that bad.

00:12:37So there's a Nick's MSG.

00:12:38What is the conference?

00:12:39I'm just saying that,

00:12:40that,

00:12:41that sometimes the game,

00:12:42game got,

00:12:43look,

00:12:44we fans,

00:12:45right?

00:12:46It shouldn't be fun.

00:12:47Why are we putting all this?

00:12:48I'll be telling people.

00:12:49I said,

00:12:50we fans in our business.

00:12:51It's their business.

00:12:52You know what I'm saying?

00:12:53Right.

00:12:54Enjoy the show.

00:12:55Right.

00:12:56Talk about LeBron.

00:12:57I'd be like,

00:12:58he talked about LeBron.

00:12:59Like he stood you up for a date.

00:13:01Yo,

00:13:02LeBron left me with a check.

00:13:03Yeah.

00:13:04You know,

00:13:05you got a legitimate reason to be mad at LeBron James,

00:13:07but you mad at him for this,

00:13:09that,

00:13:10whatever.

00:13:11And it's like,

00:13:12yo,

00:13:13man.

00:13:14So sometimes fans,

00:13:15I think these phones and the gadgets get us interconnected to the

00:13:17point a little bit too much.

00:13:19We seen it in entertainment.

00:13:20We seen it in a lot of things where,

00:13:22yo,

00:13:23I feel like I'm right with them.

00:13:24Yeah.

00:13:25You could feel like you right with them,

00:13:26but they're professional is their professionalism.

00:13:30Is that such a high regard separate yourself from that?

00:13:35I tell people all the time,

00:13:36you can talk criticism all you want.

00:13:39The closer you get to that field,

00:13:41that diamond,

00:13:42that court,

00:13:43and you ain't getting on it.

00:13:45You just getting close to it.

00:13:47Start peeling money out of your pocket.

00:13:51The more you peel out of your pocket,

00:13:53you could get close to the court.

00:13:55You ain't getting on the court.

00:13:56And I tell you,

00:13:57it used to be like that on the stage.

00:13:58You know,

00:13:59stage is like,

00:14:00you say what you want,

00:14:01but the closer you get to that stage,

00:14:02you realize that you can't do that.

00:14:04That's why we always work.

00:14:06We were,

00:14:07we were entertainment value to always be with effort and high regard.

00:14:11Yes,

00:14:12sir.

00:14:13You guys are such a popular statement,

00:14:15a group of,

00:14:16of,

00:14:17you know,

00:14:18of,

00:14:19of hip hop.

00:14:20Did you ever think that you can,

00:14:21when you started out,

00:14:22did you guys feel that you're going to get to this particular place?

00:14:25Because you are,

00:14:26you are,

00:14:27you are what,

00:14:28what people refer to now,

00:14:29like me,

00:14:30a living legend of,

00:14:31of,

00:14:32of that music,

00:14:33of that genre.

00:14:34Did you think that you could get there?

00:14:36And when you got there,

00:14:37how'd you feel?

00:14:38Because I listened to you in not necessarily your music,

00:14:42but I listened to your philosophy about life.

00:14:45And that's the thing that really impressed me about you,

00:14:48not away from the music,

00:14:49just listening to what you had to say about certain facets of life that

00:14:56we're going through.

00:14:57And it wasn't the music,

00:14:58but it was just plain damn common sense.

00:15:01Yeah.

00:15:02I mean,

00:15:03I come from good stock.

00:15:04Yeah.

00:15:05And I,

00:15:06and I paid,

00:15:07I mean,

00:15:08my dad,

00:15:09to me,

00:15:10the greatest,

00:15:11greatest in the world.

00:15:12My mom's great,

00:15:13greatest in the world.

00:15:14So it starts for them.

00:15:15And trust me,

00:15:16it's like,

00:15:17I had the type of parents.

00:15:18If I flip one second on myself,

00:15:22my,

00:15:23it was funny too.

00:15:25They'd be like,

00:15:26listen,

00:15:27when you see Chuck,

00:15:29tell me,

00:15:30I want to talk to him for a minute.

00:15:31Cause this ain't.

00:15:32Tell me when you see this boy.

00:15:37Straight forward.

00:15:40So I got people like that running jokes,

00:15:44but also really straight laser.

00:15:46Right.

00:15:47So,

00:15:48you know,

00:15:49you take that into the world where you melody,

00:15:51man.

00:15:52I used to say,

00:15:53I ain't got no wings on my feet.

00:15:54I'm going to do now.

00:15:55I'm going to do my effort in my job.

00:15:57It was public enemy.

00:15:58It was.

00:15:59So I came in there as an older person.

00:16:01I started my career when I was 27.

00:16:03So I didn't start.

00:16:04It was a,

00:16:05I was 18.

00:16:06It's a big difference,

00:16:07man,

00:16:08especially back then,

00:16:09man.

00:16:10So I came in there as a person that learned everything about hip hop.

00:16:15The music grew up with it,

00:16:16but really detailed the study and,

00:16:20say that with black music and culture and arts and education and all that.

00:16:24So I came in there not with a wealth of knowledge,

00:16:28but I came in the game with an appreciation of the wealth of knowledge.

00:16:33And I was encouraged as,

00:16:34as a young person to actually,

00:16:37when you see something that you think is great,

00:16:40and it's okay to be a fan and a fanatic of it and learn about it.

00:16:44So that's why when I had to bring up like,

00:16:46you know,

00:16:47Max is like,

00:16:48you know,

00:16:49when me and my boys see them with that UNCC and he turned,

00:16:52he turned up and then we turned up at the Omni even more.

00:16:56And the Omni is the old Atlanta arena.

00:16:59Oh,

00:17:00sweet.

00:17:01Okay.

00:17:02Did it turn into Phillips arena?

00:17:04And I don't know what they call state farm or whatever now,

00:17:06but it's the same way.

00:17:08It's the same grounds where the Omni,

00:17:12which was a state of the art architecture.

00:17:15And I think y'all almost like kind of NCAA final four was that year.

00:17:20It was like only three or four years old as a state of the art arena

00:17:24building. And in the beginning of my career, you know,

00:17:27I'm looking at these places that,

00:17:29that Max played in and I,

00:17:30and I go to the stage with an attitude, like, well,

00:17:33I'm going to tear this place down because when these players came in there

00:17:37and doing their basketball or whatever, I'm going to,

00:17:40I'm going to tear it down rap wise in the same effort.

00:17:43So we all trade off each other,

00:17:45but it takes a knowledge to have an appreciation.

00:17:48And then the appreciation is the thing that makes you a fan,

00:17:52but also makes you a professional be like, man, you can't even get close.

00:17:55You can't get close to me.

00:17:57I know too much of this as a fan.

00:18:00And I love it too much for you to beat me on a stage.

00:18:03It's not going to happen.

00:18:05So that's the bravado that we have. Oh, we used to have,

00:18:10I would say, and rap and hip hop before, I guess we, we,

00:18:14we crossed the century line and cats a little bit more sensitive.

00:18:17We wasn't sensitive. We like either you got it or you don't.

00:18:21And if you don't got it, you're going to get exposed. And if, and,

00:18:25and if you get exposed, you go home and nobody wants to go home when they

00:18:29on tour, but let you, let you have four or five bad, you know,

00:18:33shows on tour and get white. They're going to say, yo, man, we got,

00:18:37we need another group out here to pull people in. And that's how that was.

00:18:40So this competition, everything,

00:18:42this episode of the subject Maxwell podcast brought to you by price picks price

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00:19:53I got to ask him just the way you're talking about exposure and you're,

00:19:57you're the guy I would listen to.

00:19:59What in the world is going on with the music industry?

00:20:02What is going on with our comedians?

00:20:04No, you stole my question.

00:20:06That's a great question.

00:20:07He did.

00:20:09He right in front of you.

00:20:10It looks like he's just imploding with everything, right?

00:20:13You're in the New York area.

00:20:15Tell me a little bit about that because you know,

00:20:18it's crazy to hear what we hear, but we,

00:20:21but you're on the inside and you know, a lot more than we do.

00:20:24Six months, man.

00:20:26The last six months has been crazy.

00:20:28I ain't never been on the inside, bro.

00:20:30I'm with regular people ready to knock me in the head.

00:20:33If I don't hit their cash apps and die.

00:20:35So I'll just say,

00:20:40trust me, man.

00:20:42But on a peripheral, one thing I did offer myself,

00:20:45people like Ice-T, LL Cool J,

00:20:49Questlove of the Roots, stand up, stand up people, man.

00:20:55It's like, we're trying to organize this thing.

00:20:57KRS-One, we have a union started by Curtis Blow,

00:21:01KRS-One, MC Light.

00:21:03It's a union that's tied in the SAG-AFTRA.

00:21:06The only thing that's going to save your genre and save yourself

00:21:09and make it grow for years and years is organization

00:21:13and acknowledgement of what you're doing.

00:21:15And it didn't start from you.

00:21:17And I'm pretty sure Max remembers that time,

00:21:19but once upon a time,

00:21:21and this is another trip for you, Josue,

00:21:24where ballplayers, basketball players,

00:21:26used to wear dookie jewelry on the court, right?

00:21:30You remember that, Max?

00:21:32Max, did you ever wear any gold?

00:21:35Because I know you played against people like Dawkins.

00:21:38Shut up.

00:21:40I had a small gold chain that I used to wear around my neck.

00:21:44And then it started to get bigger.

00:21:46And you saw people getting bigger and bigger.

00:21:48Yeah, I need to see these.

00:21:50And really, the connection is,

00:21:52it almost like went from athletes to rappers,

00:21:55or rappers to athletes.

00:21:57And then you look at your guy, play-for-play with the clock.

00:22:01I just saw him the other day, I'm like,

00:22:03and he still got the clock.

00:22:05I'm like, damn, you still got the clock.

00:22:08Hey, hey, hey, but he's a hype man for Red Lobster.

00:22:11He's saving them from bankruptcy right now.

00:22:13Yeah, man.

00:22:15He was in the last series.

00:22:17He pulled up, right?

00:22:18Yeah, he's everywhere, man.

00:22:19In Indianapolis.

00:22:20He's my dude.

00:22:21But like I said, this was an important part for organization,

00:22:25not to be biased or racist.

00:22:28I mean, David Stern saw where this was going.

00:22:32He said, listen, it could get ridiculous if it get out of hand.

00:22:35So you remember the year that David Stern said, look, no jewelry.

00:22:39Do you remember any flip back on that, Max?

00:22:45David Stern, David Stern was, he was old school.

00:22:50We were, excuse me, we were on the plantation, okay?

00:22:54So David Stern smoked, everybody listened.

00:22:57Not too many people bucked against David Stern at that time

00:23:00because everybody thought David Stern was just a nice dude.

00:23:03I happened to talk to Sam Fussell about this,

00:23:06and Sam Fussell used to say, you know, he used to walk around

00:23:09telling me he had the big balls and all this stuff after he made the shot.

00:23:13He said, David Stern, finally went to the office and said, Sam,

00:23:16he said he was watering his plants.

00:23:18He said, Sam, there'll be no more of that damn big ball shit, okay?

00:23:22We're not doing that anymore.

00:23:25Sam said, David, he said, David, come on, man, come on.

00:23:30He said, Sam, I done told you, if you want to play,

00:23:34there will be no more of this damn big ball shit at all.

00:23:37And Sam said, he listened, he heard what David said,

00:23:40and said he never again did the big ball thing.

00:23:43The new commissioner now, he's more in line.

00:23:47Adam Silver's more in line with the players.

00:23:50And he's more of a partner for him.

00:23:55David Stern was more of a father.

00:23:57He told you what to do, and you did it.

00:24:00There was no way around that.

00:24:03Well, he had to be the enforcer in the 80s though, right, Max?

00:24:06Because with the cocaine and stuff was going on,

00:24:08wasn't that the reason why they brought him in,

00:24:10to sort of clean things up and be the enforcer?

00:24:12There was, at that time, two things that Chuck will remember.

00:24:15One was the cocaine use, but also the New York Knicks,

00:24:20and as they used to call them back then, the Knickerbockers,

00:24:24the Knickerbockers.

00:24:25Yeah, Knickerbockers.

00:24:26They did not have a black player.

00:24:28And that happened to be in the newspaper, that word, the Knickerbockers.

00:24:33So you were in a era, especially in New York,

00:24:36that was even more crazy.

00:24:38Yeah, it was one of those things where the great Barry Gordy of Motown,

00:24:43one of my heroes, said the boss of any great situation

00:24:47that you want to continue to go forward and plant seeds and grow fruit,

00:24:52the boss of those situations are logic, not a person.

00:24:56And it's got to be logical and practical.

00:24:59So what David Stern did in that day in organization

00:25:04made people look at the NBA today to just pick fruit.

00:25:09You just want these players who are under 30 years old

00:25:12to understand you stand on shoulders of giants

00:25:15that made you get what you get.

00:25:17So don't think it's about you at all.

00:25:20For me to be on the stage and not to be thinking about

00:25:23what the Isley brothers gone through in order for me to be on stage

00:25:27and have a career and be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame,

00:25:30I got to acknowledge that.

00:25:32I got to be like, you know what?

00:25:33I'm a beneficiary of time, commitment, organization,

00:25:38and there's a lot of bones I stand on.

00:25:41And I got to acknowledge that and kick back to that

00:25:43in order to make it grow forward.

00:25:45So I think the biggest difference is when you ask

00:25:48what happened in hip-hop right about now,

00:25:52the lack of leadership because you don't really need a leader

00:25:57when you do the arts, do you, or do you not?

00:26:00Tim, are you doing the arts for yourself

00:26:04or are you doing the arts to enhance the recipient?

00:26:08The genre arts.

00:26:09You know, I heard Bryant Gumbel say this once.

00:26:11He talked about a particular person who's famous.

00:26:16Matter of fact, he was a ball player too.

00:26:18He said, you know, you could do everything in the world, you know,

00:26:23to be a character, to enhance yourself,

00:26:28but you could do a great thing to have character

00:26:31and enhance the world.

00:26:33Wow.

00:26:34Yeah.

00:26:35That's a big difference, man.

00:26:36But the difference nowadays, Chuck, is guys or girls too,

00:26:40they're just creating their music, they're putting it on social media,

00:26:43they're putting it on.

00:26:44It's no longer, oh, I need to go get a manager,

00:26:46oh, I'm going to get this record deal.

00:26:48I feel like it's different now.

00:26:49And like you said, they want to be famous.

00:26:52It's not about, oh, I want to make an impact on the culture.

00:26:54No, I want to be famous and I want to do it.

00:26:56That's not a problem.

00:26:57Everybody, I think, wants to try something to emulate what they think is

00:27:01famous to make them beyond themselves.

00:27:03That's all right.

00:27:04That's like me wanting to go out.

00:27:06I could buy, you know, the jersey.

00:27:08I could buy the kicks.

00:27:10I could go to the court.

00:27:11I could even be my own announcer, right?

00:27:14I could do that a whole day.

00:27:16In my mind, I'm doing a whole, you know what I'm saying?

00:27:18In my mind.

00:27:19I think when you see these young kids, they're on YouTube,

00:27:22they're getting their thing up.

00:27:24That's an unbelievable playground.

00:27:26That next kick up into being a skilled professional is miles away.

00:27:32So I don't have a problem with somebody like, okay, yeah,

00:27:35I'm playing guitar in my basement and I'm in Indiana and I keep, you know,

00:27:40and I'm going to get my band camp together and stuff like that and I want

00:27:43to get famous at this.

00:27:45But the biggest difference today is that you're not going to get that

00:27:48cluster.

00:27:49You're going to get one by one by one by one by one.

00:27:52So I say, yeah, yeah, you're putting your music,

00:27:55you're putting your videos together.

00:27:57It's an unbelievable playground workshop.

00:28:00You got all the tools in the world.

00:28:02But now if you think you're going to be a superstar,

00:28:05you got to figure out what that skill set is and that avenue.

00:28:10How many people that y'all see all the time that, you know,

00:28:14just because they cross somebody up on the dribble thing,

00:28:16it's like it must be some kind of league waiting for me.

00:28:19Okay.

00:28:21Who's going to be the one, who's going to be the one to break the news?

00:28:24How many people do you break the news to a max on that?

00:28:29Look at you and be like, yo dog, I know, but way back in the day,

00:28:33you probably was a plumber.

00:28:35So it's like that classic question, man.

00:28:40It's like the classic question.

00:28:41How old were you when you realized you weren't going to make it to the

00:28:43league? Like, yeah,

00:28:44who were you who have and I've been,

00:28:48I think one person that I've been in awe of since I've been around this

00:28:52earth and, and, uh, and,

00:28:54and kind of met in a crazy way was Barack Obama.

00:28:59Have you, is anybody that you've been like that,

00:29:02that you were in awe of the first time you met them or you wanted to meet

00:29:07them? And all of a sudden you're like, damn, there's a such and such.

00:29:11Could be an actor, could be sports, whatever.

00:29:15Well, I mean, you study, you know, people that you're in awe of,

00:29:18you study them, man. It's just an endless array. Like, you know,

00:29:22I come from the same town as Julius Irving.

00:29:26Dr. J was our hometown hero.

00:29:29We remember when he graduated at Roosevelt high and went to UMass,

00:29:33you know, following the coach.

00:29:35You know why you about to see your mom now. Okay.

00:29:37Chuck, if you ain't never been in the position where you about to get dunked

00:29:41on by this dude, it is crazy.

00:29:45You one-on-one and you standing there.

00:29:47It's like you in a rap battle with somebody and this dude coming at you and

00:29:51you know what's about to happen, but you can't do a damn thing about it.

00:29:55That was crazy about guarding the dog.

00:29:58I had the, I had the opportunity to do the narration for Dr. J's, uh,

00:30:02documentary. And, uh, and you was in, they had a clip of you in there.

00:30:06And you were like, you said, you know,

00:30:0820,000 people started to stand up in the spectrum. He's like,

00:30:11something's bad about to happen.

00:30:17And I tell people all the time, just like, it's hard to explain.

00:30:21I was telling you, I was telling you, I was saying, it's hard to explain.

00:30:26I was telling you, I was telling you, I was telling you,

00:30:29I was telling you, I was telling you, I was telling you, I was telling you,

00:30:31I was telling you, I was telling you, I was telling you.

00:30:32I said, it's hard to explain the legend.

00:30:33I have cornbread Maxwell came out of seemingly nowhere and just took over the

00:30:37world. Right. And then I was like,

00:30:40how does Celtics are getting him to Larry Bird and

00:30:44and Mikhail and the legend.

00:30:46This is the part I want to hear about, because I, you know, when,

00:30:49before you told me all that, like,

00:30:51how you've been a fan with Max, like I'm thinking to myself,

00:30:54this dude's probably a prior chief of the Lakers in the eighties,

00:30:57he's probably couldn't stand Max or whatever.

00:30:59But then I come to find out you were a fan

00:31:00before he even got into the league, man.

00:31:02Yo, man, he turned up.

00:31:03Just like it's hard to explain.

00:31:06Here's his two other areas in basketball relatedness.

00:31:09It's hard to explain the aura of Julius Ervin

00:31:12when he entered the NBA from the ABA.

00:31:16It's like you can't even explain it

00:31:18because it's not, you can't even put it in words.

00:31:20It's like, it was like, it was like,

00:31:23I ain't never seen nothing in basketball since then.

00:31:25It's like the world kind of like, everything was like,

00:31:29because here's this dude that everybody been talking about.

00:31:33And understand this, and Max was in college during this time.

00:31:37George McGuinness came out of the ABA

00:31:39and tore up the NBA in 75.

00:31:42He just tore it up.

00:31:44And then the next year, the ABA folded.

00:31:47They say, oh, the Doc is coming.

00:31:49And now...

00:31:53I can't explain.

00:31:54Listen, ESPN, and this is my take on it,

00:31:58built a whole network off of knowing that...

00:32:03highlights would be a thing that would be enough

00:32:06to put around 24 hours a day.

00:32:08Dr. J, right?

00:32:10Coming from New York, Long Island, Roosevelt, right?

00:32:14When he went down and was traded to the Sixers,

00:32:17Wanda Wolf on New York TV would show more Sixer highlights

00:32:23with Dr. J than the Knicks or Nets at that time.

00:32:28He'd be like, Wanda Wolf would be like,

00:32:29and Wanda Wolf don't get no credit.

00:32:31He'd be like, matter of fact, let's go down

00:32:33to the spectrum in Philadelphia.

00:32:34Junior Sergeant versus the Pacers, baby.

00:32:37He would show Dr. J highlights in New York, you know, TV.

00:32:44Young man, it's hard to, yo, listen,

00:32:46it's hard to explain Dr. J.

00:32:48So, Cornbread Maxwell comes out of UNCC.

00:32:52Out of seemingly nowhere, and he's on everybody's mouth.

00:32:57So, we follow as fanatics, the phenomenon.

00:33:00It's hard to put in words, man.

00:33:02Today, everything is put in words,

00:33:05and there's got to be a reason for this.

00:33:06That's why I said earlier,

00:33:08before we had technical difficulties,

00:33:11Luka hasn't exercised his Byrds rights yet.

00:33:13You don't compare anything to Larry Byrd

00:33:19or Magic Johnson, really.

00:33:22Because I don't even understand how Larry Byrd

00:33:27comes out of nowhere in Indiana State,

00:33:32and then all of a sudden comes out.

00:33:34And it's like, yeah, he loses the Final Four final.

00:33:41And that time, we had like four Final Fours

00:33:44that was just, not really yet,

00:33:46eight Final Fours in the NCAA,

00:33:49starting from Max.

00:33:51Because I think the year before,

00:33:52I think Indiana won it, right?

00:33:54Yeah.

00:33:55And that was just like, uh, you know.

00:33:57But when Max came in and Marquette won,

00:34:01and they beat Max,

00:34:02because everybody liked Marquette

00:34:04because of their jerseys that nobody ever seen to this day.

00:34:07They had jerseys that you couldn't even tuck them in, right?

00:34:12Were you jealous of their jerseys, Max?

00:34:14I was. I think somebody...

00:34:17He said, I was.

00:34:18Butch Lee, no, it was one of the guys who played,

00:34:23Bo Ellis.

00:34:24Oh, Bo Ellis.

00:34:25Bo Ellis supposedly designed the jersey

00:34:27that was worn at that time.

00:34:29And yeah, that was a cool thing.

00:34:31But you had them, you had UNLV with the Running Rebels.

00:34:36The Reggie Feds, right?

00:34:37Oh, man, big Afros coming at you.

00:34:40It shouldn't be.

00:34:41The first time I saw Dr. J, I looked at him,

00:34:45and I remember hearing Robinson talk about

00:34:47how he looked at Jordan the first time.

00:34:50That's the way I looked at Juniors.

00:34:52I'm like, he's a human.

00:34:55It looked like there was an aura around him.

00:34:57Yo, there's an aura around Jordan, man.

00:34:59When I first saw Jordan, there was a gold aura around this dude.

00:35:02And it was so crazy, Josue, that we used to...

00:35:06Essentially, when Philadelphia, they would have a...

00:35:09They would warm up, and they would dunk.

00:35:12We on the other side, we stopped.

00:35:14I would stop, and I would sit down

00:35:16like I'm a damn fan and stuff, watching these niggas dunk.

00:35:20Like...

00:35:21-...

00:35:23Why?

00:35:24Everything's like a movie now.

00:35:25It holds weight.

00:35:26They had Kobe's pops, right?

00:35:30Oh, man, yeah.

00:35:31World B Free was a dunker.

00:35:34Julius was a dunker.

00:35:36I mean, Bobby Joe, man, they had all these dudes.

00:35:39And then, after they do their dunks,

00:35:43and then Julius would get and do something crazy.

00:35:45And the whole place would go ballistic.

00:35:49And that's why I said, when he first stepped on the court,

00:35:53and the first time I ever guarded him,

00:35:54he scored 45 on me.

00:35:56I might as well have been a freaking maitre d'.

00:35:59Because I didn't touch it the whole time.

00:36:00I'm like, no, this way.

00:36:02And I'm looking at him like, damn, that was another nice move, man.

00:36:05I was a...

00:36:06I was a...

00:36:07Check this, I was a bitch.

00:36:09That's what I was like.

00:36:10I was a bitch.

00:36:13Not even from the bench, you're doing it on the court.

00:36:16Are you serious here with this dude, some of the moves?

00:36:19And he... That was his...

00:36:21That time was his career high, he had 45 against me.

00:36:25And I don't know if I ever touched him the whole freaking time.

00:36:28Because I was freaking petrified.

00:36:30Then that was in the regular season.

00:36:32Then we played them again later on, I got used to them.

00:36:35And then we started banging them around, it was really cool.

00:36:37But, yeah, man, that New York connection,

00:36:40I hear that all the time about, you know, a New Yorker myself.

00:36:43I'm not a New Yorker myself, but Nate Archibald,

00:36:46one of my best friends.

00:36:47And, you know, he always used to talk about New York.

00:36:50He always talked about Rutgers Park.

00:36:52The first thing he talked about,

00:36:53he said, you don't know nothing until you ain't seen Joe Hammond,

00:36:56the destroyer, nigga.

00:36:58I was like, who is that?

00:36:59The destroyer.

00:37:01Rutgers Park, there's a brother named Joe Hammond

00:37:04that ended up selling drugs.

00:37:06But he was like, he was just walking in,

00:37:10put his damn sneakers on, and then go out and score 60.

00:37:13Supposedly, he scored 60 against Julius Ervin

00:37:15when he was playing at that time.

00:37:17But Joe Hammond is that living legend.

00:37:20Tell us a little bit about Joe Hammond

00:37:22because I know you know about him.

00:37:24Yeah, I mean, you always used to get, you know, the talk

00:37:27because, like, Doc came from Roosevelt,

00:37:30and Doc came from Roosevelt, Long Island.

00:37:32See, in New York, you know, Long Island,

00:37:36even Queens and Brooklyn was also considered country.

00:37:40There was one city spot that they say was city in the 60s,

00:37:43and that was Harlem, and that's where it was,

00:37:46Manhattan and Harlem.

00:37:48Everything else was a suburb.

00:37:49So if you wasn't coming from Harlem,

00:37:51you was considered country.

00:37:52And then further out in Long Island,

00:37:54where we from, the counties,

00:37:55you really country or Jersey or whatever.

00:37:58But by the 70s, Doc went from Long Island

00:38:02and turned the Rutgers out.

00:38:05Because, I mean, you had people like Connie Hawkins,

00:38:07and you had the Rutgers going on for years,

00:38:09and they said Doc was, he brought in a whole new way

00:38:12of looking at things.

00:38:14But Joe Hammond was one of the dudes, they said,

00:38:17that never missed, and you couldn't stop him.

00:38:19And that word got out and be like, oh, man.

00:38:22And it's like, yeah, man,

00:38:23the Lakers want to pick up Joe Hammond,

00:38:25but he don't think they got enough money.

00:38:27It's a...

00:38:28It's a... Yeah, he got his pimp mobile.

00:38:31He, I mean, straight out of,

00:38:33straight out of a 1972 Blacksboy Chaser play.

00:38:36You know, I mean, people like Pee Wee Kirkland,

00:38:39I mean, those dudes was like, they was already,

00:38:40they in Harlem, they Harlem Knights.

00:38:42They like, they already at the Mecca

00:38:44or whatever of attention and fame.

00:38:47They got local Manhattan, center of the earth,

00:38:51Mecca fame.

00:38:53But here's a question I like to ask you.

00:38:55A lot of times people ask me about,

00:38:57about players as a fan and comparing errors.

00:39:00Max will tell you, and here, mark my word right here.

00:39:05I don't think you'll get the same amount of play

00:39:08if players, if you want to see a throwback game,

00:39:11put them in Chuck Taylor's 70s Converse's short shorts.

00:39:17Yo, how do y'all use the ball?

00:39:18Put them on the old Boston parquet floor,

00:39:22and that's how you have a real throwback game.

00:39:25You ain't even got to have the new players

00:39:27play against the old players.

00:39:29Have the new players play in old equipment.

00:39:32I don't think their union will have it.

00:39:33But, Chip, they did that one time.

00:39:36They did?

00:39:37They did it, and for half of a game,

00:39:40the Lakers get Lakers versus Celtics.

00:39:43And Kobe Bryant had these short shorts on

00:39:46and all this other stuff.

00:39:47Oh, because they're doing throwback night.

00:39:49Yeah, I remember that. Okay. Yeah.

00:39:51Yeah.

00:39:52So at halftime, they changed over.

00:39:55So he came over to me at halftime, he said,

00:39:57man, I don't know how the hell y'all played in that shit.

00:40:01I'm saying exactly what you talked about.

00:40:04You had the converse on, they had the short shorts on,

00:40:08and you were low on pump.

00:40:09Andrew Bynum looks hilarious, man.

00:40:11He looks so funny with those shorts.

00:40:14Yeah, that's what I'm telling you, man.

00:40:16I stop conversations and comparisons right there.

00:40:20I don't get into this, that, whatever.

00:40:22I said, you know, if you want to compare the players now

00:40:25and the players back then,

00:40:28yo, Syracuse Arena is still standing there.

00:40:32Rochester Arena is still standing there.

00:40:35Get them in them old arenas,

00:40:38take them in a van there or a train,

00:40:40and then put them in their old equipment gear.

00:40:43But number one, their agents and the lawyers and the leagues

00:40:45and whatever, CBA agreement, never let that happen.

00:40:49But I said, if you want to really show these young people

00:40:53that this is what they played in,

00:40:56and that's where you start to see results.

00:40:58You won't see a quick crossover.

00:41:00You won't see too many jab steps and unbelievable

00:41:04because the equipment today is exceptional.

00:41:08The footwear is designed and, you know, I mean,

00:41:12how, you know, and then, of course,

00:41:13I'm not even talking about, like, the medicine

00:41:15and the doctors and all that.

00:41:17Put them in their old equipment.

00:41:18Because the first, excuse me.

00:41:21Did you think that Converse...

00:41:24You didn't know Converse was as bad as they were?

00:41:28Would it fall off?

00:41:29That's what you're trying to say?

00:41:30Because if you put on Converse right now,

00:41:32you walk down the street and twist your damn ankle.

00:41:35That is it. That might be the worst.

00:41:37How did they do that?

00:41:39It has no support at all.

00:41:42How do they do that, Max?

00:41:45Because in the 60s, it's like, you got that tape job,

00:41:49you got tape ankle job,

00:41:51and then you got in the Chuck Taylors.

00:41:52The same thing that fly girls be wearing

00:41:56in different colors, right?

00:41:58And y'all running a full court, like,

00:42:00full court game in those?

00:42:01That's why you can't talk about Bill Russell.

00:42:05You can't talk nothing about Bill Russell

00:42:06because Bill Russell is doing all those things

00:42:08and them kicks.

00:42:10And low cuts.

00:42:13And low cuts.

00:42:15Low cuts.

00:42:16With lesser ankle injuries.

00:42:19This episode of the Cedric Maxwell podcast

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00:43:22Here's another thing I kind of don't like

00:43:25about the modern game.

00:43:27And when it comes down, somebody need to pull Lucas Cotel,

00:43:31maybe Tatum's, sometimes Josh Hart with the Knicks

00:43:34and our player.

00:43:35Yo, man, everybody carrying the ball, man.

00:43:38Because when you look at clips from back in the day,

00:43:41Oscar Robinson got that hand on that ball like that.

00:43:44Jerry West, that hand on top, tiny arch ball.

00:43:47That hand is like this.

00:43:49I don't understand this, man.

00:43:50It's like, why is Adam Silver allowed?

00:43:53I mean, when you can bring the ball up to your head

00:43:56and have it on the side of you and still keep the dribble.

00:43:58I'm like, you know what?

00:43:59I'm going to answer this question for you.

00:44:01And let me tell you why.

00:44:02And I talked to him about this about,

00:44:05must have been about three months ago.

00:44:07Who destroyed the game?

00:44:10Patrick Ewing.

00:44:12Patrick Ewing, he was at the International House of Players.

00:44:16And they turned the ball over.

00:44:18I'm like, how he dribbling?

00:44:20So don't tell me nothing about people destroying the game.

00:44:24And Chuck, as we like to say, you're

00:44:26licking your own fucking pants.

00:44:29You gotta talk about somebody destroying the game.

00:44:31Patrick Ewing was the first one to carry it

00:44:34like that every single time.

00:44:36I remember.

00:44:38I, yeah, I'm telling you, every clip, it's like, poof, poof,

00:44:45poof, shot, you know what I'm saying?

00:44:50Yeah, Nick, as a Nick fan, yes.

00:44:52But we're talking, we're talking,

00:44:56we're talking basketball in the sense of the way

00:44:58it was back then compared to it now.

00:45:00But what about rap, Chuck?

00:45:01How are you feeling about today's artist

00:45:03and how the genre has been?

00:45:05I mean, I'd be remiss if I didn't bring up the whole Drake

00:45:08and Kendrick Lamar beat, but just overall,

00:45:10how do you feel about where rap is right now in 2024?

00:45:14Everybody got their audience.

00:45:15Your number one job to turn your audience out.

00:45:18Make your spell audience with A-W-E.

00:45:20If you ain't turn your audience out, you ain't doing the job.

00:45:23It ain't really you against anybody else.

00:45:25It's you against your audience.

00:45:27Make them like, damn, I ain't never seen

00:45:29nothing like that in my life.

00:45:30If they just like, millennials, like, most of the time,

00:45:33they like this.

00:45:34I mean, their emotions is in their phone.

00:45:37So it's harder for the, it's harder to impress them

00:45:41because, I was like, well, you know,

00:45:42they have to figure something out.

00:45:44There's things out there that are blowing their mind.

00:45:46But you got to figure out that straight line

00:45:49between I'm doing something and I got your attention

00:45:52by doing something you cannot do.

00:45:55And that's the bottom line of entertainment.

00:45:57And we can't, and we got to also look at,

00:46:00don't take things for granted that you can't, you know,

00:46:05that's just because it's on a screen

00:46:06doesn't mean that it's real.

00:46:08I mean, we look at this thing sometimes like,

00:46:11we look at an old Sammy Davis Jr. clip.

00:46:14And you'd be like, oh, he got, does he got AI going with him?

00:46:17He's like, yeah, nah, nah.

00:46:22And the same thing, like, so today's rappers,

00:46:24and this goes back even to the question

00:46:25you was going to ask about, did Converse drop the ball

00:46:28also in marketing?

00:46:31Number one, in the middle of the 80s,

00:46:33they didn't pick up and Nike came in.

00:46:36But Nike came in, run DFC, did my Adidas.

00:46:41And kids was buying Adidas.

00:46:44Yeah, that's what's rocking in Boston, man.

00:46:47Like, yeah, they be buying all the air.

00:46:50And Nike knew that they had to have some kind of hip hop in it.

00:46:54So what happens?

00:46:56In the 80s, especially after that Michael Jordan

00:46:58game against the Suffolks.

00:47:00Yep.

00:47:01Said, listen, MJ, not just Michael Jordan,

00:47:04because I mean, basketball players

00:47:06been doing incredible things all their lives, man.

00:47:08I mean, that could mean you're going to sell kicks.

00:47:11Spike Lee took Michael Jordan and Mars Blackmon,

00:47:15from She's Gotta Have It, a Brooklyn B-boy.

00:47:20Michael Jordan got street cred that he didn't necessarily

00:47:24really had or deserved.

00:47:26He was this incredible ball player.

00:47:28Just a ball player.

00:47:29But where that Brooklyn hip hop street cred come from?

00:47:33Didn't come from MJ.

00:47:34It came from Spike Lee.

00:47:36And Spike Lee had Mars Blackmon, and that combination, boom,

00:47:39shot Nike up.

00:47:41Everybody had to have their Air Jordans.

00:47:43And two years before that, who had to get what?

00:47:46Run DMC, made people go out there and get my Adidas.

00:47:50Now here we are in 2024, 2025, and everything is everything

00:47:56is everything is anything.

00:47:57I think it also boils down to, I think

00:48:01it's a beautiful thing when a person is 45 years old

00:48:04and sitting at a dinner banquet, and they ask,

00:48:07like, what's your occupation?

00:48:08And the person says rapper, and you're going to get laughed at.

00:48:13I'm a college graduate, right?

00:48:15I'm a designer.

00:48:16I'm an engineer, all kinds of stuff like that.

00:48:19But I'm sitting at a table, man.

00:48:21So what do you do?

00:48:22I mean, what's your profession?

00:48:23Rapper.

00:48:25That shit ain't washing in the 80s, man, or not.

00:48:28And it's something I do, and I could do well.

00:48:31And what got me into it, I knew that I had a voice

00:48:34and a know-how that nobody could match.

00:48:37But that, you know, I mean, yeah, it

00:48:39ended up being an incredible part of my life

00:48:44because I'm fanatical about the occupation, the profession,

00:48:47and want to make it so.

00:48:49But I'm also a firm believer that you write half your life,

00:48:52and life writes the other half.

00:48:54Man, man, plans.

00:48:55God laughs, you know what I'm saying?

00:48:57So a plan, but plan anyway, like Doc told me.

00:49:00So I just think, I mean.

00:49:03I got to hit you with one of these before you go, man.

00:49:06We so appreciate you being on.

00:49:07But I have got to get you, got to have

00:49:11your opinion about Cat Wiggins.

00:49:14And just, man, he done threw shade.

00:49:18You know, that was like the second day of the year, too.

00:49:21Remember?

00:49:22That was the beginning.

00:49:23I want to get it real from you, who knows the industry,

00:49:28but knows all these other people.

00:49:30And what he said, that is just, it's been dog-eat-dog right now.

00:49:37So just tell me a little bit about that, how you feel.

00:49:39Because I love to hear your opinion about Cat Williams

00:49:43and the controversy that he's kind of stirred.

00:49:47Number one, you know, people say a lot of different things.

00:49:50I'm not a firm believer that, you know, all news is good

00:49:53news.

00:49:54You hear people like, you know what, news, you know,

00:49:57any publicity is publicity.

00:49:59You know, if you balk at somebody, people know,

00:50:02that means at least they know it.

00:50:03I'm a firm believer that that's not always true.

00:50:09You got people that don't like each other.

00:50:11That's just the way life is.

00:50:13Well, you going to tell me about somebody else,

00:50:17what that got to do with me?

00:50:18Ain't none of my business, you know?

00:50:22I think we as rappers seeing comedians always in the area,

00:50:28rappers in the area, we try to get people out

00:50:32of the making beef real.

00:50:35Like, I mean, Tupac was like a nephew to me,

00:50:38you know what I'm saying?

00:50:39So Younger Bro, the whole that thing

00:50:43escalated because what it did is sold newspapers, magazines,

00:50:47records, media attention.

00:50:50And we see it culminate in tragedy

00:50:52that they still ain't been able to get out of.

00:50:54My good friend, Jam Master Jay, who's

00:50:56the closest thing to a union leader you ever want to see,

00:51:00killed, you know?

00:51:01A lot of rappers got killed in cases

00:51:03that they never, ever discussed.

00:51:04So we tried to get far away from saying

00:51:09that had anything to do with the arts or something real.

00:51:13Comedians always seem to travel together,

00:51:17joke together, laugh together.

00:51:18And then when Spike Lee did a movie with the Four

00:51:24Kings of Comedy, that just took it to another level.

00:51:27And a lot of people are like, damn, man.

00:51:31Well, why is it hard for a rapper to travel?

00:51:34Yeah, well, you got to have this, that, and the other.

00:51:36You got a backdrop.

00:51:37You know, you got set.

00:51:38You got speakers.

00:51:40You got musicians.

00:51:41You got DJs.

00:51:42You got all that.

00:51:43All the comedian needs a glass of water, man.

00:51:45Speaker, yo, speaker, speaker, mic, glass of water,

00:51:51and a stage, and a promoter look at that.

00:51:54It's like, I ain't got no overhead.

00:51:57And the comedians kept rising and rising.

00:52:00I thought people, like, said, damn, should I be a rapper?

00:52:02Or should I be a comedian?

00:52:04And a lot of people took that comedian route

00:52:06and saw that so many places to play,

00:52:09especially during sad times, you know?

00:52:12And they don't want to be a comedian.

00:52:14And they all exploded.

00:52:16Now, who exploded?

00:52:18For whatever reason, that became a league of its own.

00:52:21And a lot of people, like, been looking at each other

00:52:24for the last 20, 25 years, and people don't even know it.

00:52:27Man, I've been traveling with them.

00:52:29I remember them back in the day.

00:52:30So they got something that all of a sudden

00:52:32fruited to the front of mainstream culture,

00:52:37when 25 years ago, people were like, yeah, you know,

00:52:40a black dude doing comedy, man.

00:52:42It was a big deal, you know what I'm saying?

00:52:43Now it's like mainstream culture across a couple

00:52:47of new generations getting it.

00:52:49Remember this.

00:52:50The businesses, whether they're promoters, marketers,

00:52:53branders, or whatever, we say branders,

00:52:57because branding wasn't always a great thing

00:53:00for black folk in America.

00:53:01I mean, the minute we got off the boat,

00:53:03they took that iron and went, brand, you know what I'm saying?

00:53:07And we got what?

00:53:08We tatted with a Kilo, you know what I'm saying,

00:53:11a Keloid brand on us.

00:53:13So they always want to be able to get somebody green.

00:53:19You know what green means, Oswe.

00:53:21Not Celtics green, green.

00:53:25Yeah, I mean, like something that appeases everybody.

00:53:27No, no.

00:53:29Green is getting somebody who's young, naive, dumb, fool,

00:53:33whatever.

00:53:34Oh, got you.

00:53:35Got you raw, raw on the boat.

00:53:37I can see you coming.

00:53:39I could get you.

00:53:41Matter of fact, I know more about you than you know yourself.

00:53:44And if you under 25, and really, if you're the typical,

00:53:48then you know nothing, and you got less.

00:53:53And when you get something, I'm going to get it from you.

00:53:56So the powers and the corporations

00:53:58and the businesses that be, you always got that in the mind.

00:54:03We're going to get new engineers.

00:54:04We're going to get new generations,

00:54:05because they're green.

00:54:06They don't know it all.

00:54:07They don't even know they don't know it all.

00:54:09And we're going to get them.

00:54:11And once we get them, we're like, gotcha.

00:54:13That's a New York in you, because New Yorkers always

00:54:18look for the fucking boys.

00:54:20At first, they go, hey, yo, Green, come here a minute.

00:54:22Let me talk to you.

00:54:23The hustle that you had on, that was like because that

00:54:27in one of Stevie Wonder's songs, where the guy,

00:54:29he comes there to New York City.

00:54:31New York City, big, beautiful.

00:54:33And then somebody says, give him a bag and say, yo, man,

00:54:36let me start free from you.

00:54:37And the guy said, what?

00:54:39Next thing you know, police grab him, take him on.

00:54:42And he said, no, man, I didn't do anything.

00:54:45But New York culture, man.

00:54:47New York culture, keep it moving.

00:54:49That's why politically, on what, 45,

00:54:54I don't even say his name, president number 45,

00:54:57he done gamed the country.

00:54:59The rest of the world's hip to this dude.

00:55:01But he done gamed the country.

00:55:03And it's so crazy, he gamed the middle of the country.

00:55:05And not saying that the old dude is better,

00:55:09but this dude, I mean, I've been looking at that 45

00:55:12before it was 45, like he is a celebrity.

00:55:15He ain't fit to be president, he is a celebrity.

00:55:18I've been seeing this dude since the mid-70s, man, you know?

00:55:21But he gamed-

00:55:23Well, he wanted to start a network

00:55:24and then it just snowballed into a campaign.

00:55:26That was crazy.

00:55:27He's using old game, old New York game on,

00:55:32and he'll tell you too, I'm going to go into the backwoods

00:55:38of the United States and meet with the people

00:55:41like he gave a damn.

00:55:42But anyway, that's another statement.

00:55:43Another point-

00:55:45That's for the next episode.

00:55:46Before I end this, another impressionable person on me,

00:55:52and this is Stevie Wonder, right?

00:55:57Wow, that's my guy.

00:55:58Every time I come and Stevie Wonders cypher in his area,

00:56:04I can't say shit.

00:56:06This is for years.

00:56:08I don't know what the fuck to say to Stevie.

00:56:10Mm-hmm.

00:56:12You know, like, and Stevie can see and hear everything.

00:56:15They say, hey, Stevie said, come over.

00:56:17And I go over and I'm staring at him and shit.

00:56:21I never could get, I don't know what, I never,

00:56:26I'm telling you, listen, Max, this is for years.

00:56:29This is the 80s, the 90s.

00:56:30Yo, that's Max's go right there.

00:56:32That's his favorite.

00:56:3280s, 90s, 2000s, you know?

00:56:37And he'll say, hey, Chuck, there's Sin Factor power.

00:56:39And I'm like, I don't know.

00:56:43I can't.

00:56:50He must be like, man, this dude, man, he's like,

00:56:53hey, he don't never say nothing.

00:56:55I'm like, I don't know where to start, bro.

00:56:57I've been hearing this dude, man, since I was three years

00:56:59old in the crib, tearing my crib up every time

00:57:03fingertips come on.

00:57:04Ever since, hey, yeah!

00:57:07So he's a favorite since I was three years old.

00:57:09Uptight, everything all right.

00:57:11I was made to love you, you know.

00:57:14All that stuff, you know, inner visions and all that.

00:57:17It's King Duke and all that.

00:57:19Yo, Sir Duke, I, this is my secret area.

00:57:24I, in all my conversations with Stevie Wonder

00:57:29throughout 40 years, I ain't said shit.

00:57:33I don't know where to start, bro.

00:57:35I don't even know where to start.

00:57:36We're going to get this to Stevie Wonder somehow.

00:57:39Yeah, you're going to have to figure this out for real.

00:57:42I don't, I don't know where to begin.

00:57:44I don't, how do you, how do you, how do you

00:57:46start with, like, Stevie, huh?

00:57:49I asked you earlier, I said, who are you in R.R.

00:57:52This is him.

00:57:53This is, this is it.

00:57:54This is it right here.

00:57:57Yeah, same thing with Smokey Robinson.

00:57:59I just sat across the table, Smokey Robinson.

00:58:01I ain't say shit.

00:58:03I'm like, where do I start, man?

00:58:05Where, where, I, I, you know, I, you know,

00:58:10I don't even know where to start.

00:58:11What would you say to Stevie?

00:58:14See, you don't even know.

00:58:16No, no.

00:58:17You don't even know.

00:58:18I would, no, I'm just like Chuck D.

00:58:20I would say he, we, we grew up with his songs.

00:58:24My Cherie Amour, I was in love with a girl

00:58:27in the eighth grade, and I used to play this song

00:58:29as loud as that could possibly be.

00:58:31And I swore that I was going, this, this song

00:58:34was going to take me to this girl

00:58:36and she was going to be forever mine.

00:58:38So I know what he's talking about with Stevie,

00:58:40when he's talking about Sir Duke or when he's talking

00:58:43about, you know, keys to, you know, of life.

00:58:47Of life.

00:58:47That's your favorite album.

00:58:48All these things he had on.

00:58:50You know, the one, the one guy, Chuck,

00:58:51I wish I had met after I ended up seeing

00:58:56this movie was I wish I hadn't met Ray Charles.

00:58:59Oh, yeah, man.

00:59:00Because Ray Charles just seemed like he was so, you know,

00:59:04and I met, I had a couple of times to go see Ray Charles.

00:59:06I was like, I don't want to see.

00:59:07But after I ended up seeing a movie of Ray Charles,

00:59:10I was fascinated with his music and everything else.

00:59:14I heard bits and pieces of it.

00:59:16But when I saw all the things that, you know,

00:59:19that were done on him, done by him,

00:59:22and that movie was a great movie.

00:59:23Yeah, man.

00:59:25It's one of those things that Jimmy Fox

00:59:26crushed that room is such a magnificent job of a job.

00:59:30And I look at another guy, a New Yorker.

00:59:33When you look at Denzel, another guy.

00:59:35Yeah.

00:59:36Do you say shit around Denzel?

00:59:38Man, you better not talk.

00:59:40People better not say nothing against Denzel.

00:59:42Denzel is protected, man, by culture and the gods, man.

00:59:46I'll tell you, listen, when the L.A. Rebellion went down in 92,

00:59:51Denzel was out there with a shovel.

00:59:54Denzel Washington was out there with a shovel

00:59:56in the community, man.

00:59:57Shoveling.

00:59:58And that dude is just, he's just something else, man.

01:00:03You know, so there's so many people.

01:00:05I mean, back in the day, right?

01:00:06And I don't mean to go over, but you know,

01:00:08you could chop this up or whatever.

01:00:10Yo, Dr. J. Me and my boys are coming from the park.

01:00:13We go up to, they had a church's fried chicken in Roosevelt.

01:00:16And he came back to see one of his old mentors and coaches.

01:00:20And him and his mentor and coach was sitting right,

01:00:23it was just us in churches.

01:00:25So me and, you know, me and my two boys is like,

01:00:28we talking about, Doc is like in the next thing, right?

01:00:31This is 1978.

01:00:33We like, so what the fuck are we really talking about, man?

01:00:36We just.

01:00:37Yo, hey, Doc, how's that thigh, man?

01:00:43You know?

01:00:44What's your favorite piece, Ray?

01:00:45Did you get yours crispy or hot sauce?

01:00:50Yeah, I understand when you talk about people who are amazing.

01:00:55It's all, Max, it's all right to be a fan.

01:00:58I'm telling you, it's a beautiful thing.

01:01:01It's all right to be a fan, but not when you

01:01:04playing against a fucking guy.

01:01:05Oh, of course not.

01:01:07That was wild, Max.

01:01:08I never heard that story, Max.

01:01:10That was wild.

01:01:11You playing against this guy and you got to go heads up

01:01:14and then you're looking like, oh, shit.

01:01:16This is damn Doc I'm guarding, and your boys looking at you.

01:01:20You know, after you get through playing,

01:01:21you always come home and your boys go, yo, man,

01:01:24what the fuck was that you did with the hot dog stick?

01:01:27Man, I was like you, Chuck, I couldn't touch it.

01:01:30But then later on, but how much did ML Carr egg you on

01:01:34to just, just, just, just be, you know,

01:01:37he was, he was a circus promoter, a lot of guys,

01:01:41you know, hyped up, man, because that was my guy, man.

01:01:44He was the one that we were kind of country boys together.

01:01:47But he was the one that actually made Kevin McHale jump on

01:01:52the ramps because they were talking about it.

01:01:54So, man, I ain't gonna have no more fast break.

01:01:56There'll be no more fast break.

01:01:58And the next thing you know, he's like,

01:01:59I'm going to have to go home and I'm going to have to go

01:02:01home and I'm going to have to go home and I'm going to have

01:02:03to go home and I'm going to have to go home and I'm going

01:02:05And the next thing, you know, Kevin gets in the game

01:02:09and boom, grabs around the neck.

01:02:14And Kevin is a scariest dude, of all.

01:02:17I would have never picked him, dude, to grab somebody to

01:02:21he was hyped up by the Hike Man, ML Carr at that time,

01:02:24So it was crazy.

01:02:25That's gonna do it for this episode, man.

01:02:28Sorry, man. I don't know.

01:02:32No, man, this is this is incredible, man.

01:02:34Man, thank you for coming on, Chuck D.

01:02:36Man, we definitely have to get you back on here for sure, man.

01:02:39Yeah, man, you know, subject's going to be,

01:02:41you know, 16 and 2 as a Knicks fan.

01:02:43Like I said, I got to shout out my guys,

01:02:45CP the Fanchise.

01:02:47We're over there, you know, Knicks off season, on season.

01:02:51I'm in the mosh pit, man, over there at Knicks fan TV,

01:02:54and he's also got the NBA report,

01:02:57so it's all part of this middle media sensation.

01:03:00But like I said, I've been, by default,

01:03:03I've been hearing, you know, Celtics broadcast on SiriusXM,

01:03:08and Max, man, you remind me also of Don Merida.

01:03:13At the end of the game, when the end of that game is over,

01:03:16Don Merida would go into a saying or into a song,

01:03:21and you'd be like, wow, how did he come up with that?

01:03:26Party's over.

01:03:28My dad used to sing that all the time.

01:03:30My dad would be, like, watching the game,

01:03:32and all of a sudden, he'd sing going,

01:03:34turn out the lights.

01:03:37You remind me so much of Danny Don,

01:03:41at the end, especially the fourth quarter, man.

01:03:44Thank you, my brother. We appreciate it.

01:03:45Appreciate you, my guy. Thank you.

Chuck D on Rap & NBA’s Evolution + Favorite Max Memories | Cedric Maxwell Podcast

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