LIVE: Patriots Part Ways with Bill Belichick After 24 Seasons | Patriots Daily - video Dailymotion

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Bill Belichick and the New England Patriots are expected to part way, concluding an extraordinary 24-season partnership. This period, marked by an unparalleled six Super Bowl titles, represents a historic era in NFL history. In response to this significant development, CLNS Media's Taylor Kyles and John Zannis will be going LIVE to offer their reactions on Patriots Daily!  Fanduel Sportsbook is the exclusive wagering parter of the CLNS Media Network! Right now, NEW customers get ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTY in BONUS BETS – GUARANTEED when you place a FIVE DOLLAR BET. That’s A HUNDRED AND FIFTY BUCKS in BONUS BETS – WIN OR LOSE! Go to https://FanDuel.com/BOSTON! The app is so easy to use and there are so many different ways to bet like:  ● Live Same Game Parlays ● Find Bets in the NEW Explore Tab ● Make a parlay in the Parlay Hub – the best way to find popular parlays ● And more!  DISCLAIMER: Must be 21+ and present in select states. FanDuel is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas Star Casino, LLC. First online real money wager only. $10 first deposit required. Bonus issued as nonwithdrawable bonus bets that expire 7 days after receipt. Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit FanDuel.com/RG in Colorado, Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, New Jersey, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Tennessee, and Virginia. Call 1-800-NEXT-STEP or text NEXTSTEP to 53342 in Arizona, 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org/chat in Connecticut, 1-800-9-WITH-IT in Indiana, 1-800-522-4700 or visit ksgamblinghelp.com in Kansas, 1-877-770-STOP in Louisiana, visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland, visit 1800gambler.net in West Virginia, or call 1-800-522-4700 in Wyoming. Hope is here. Visit GamblingHelpLineMA.org or call (800) 327-5050 for 24/7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8HOPE-NY or text HOPENY in New York.

Transcript

00:00:00 - No. - No.

00:00:02 - Really? - Yeah.

00:00:03 - It's really cool. - Ahmed doesn't tell me anything.

00:00:05 Let's do it.

00:00:06 - How cool is that? - I think it's special.

00:00:26 Pretty cool.

00:00:27 Hey, I know people are just trickling in

00:00:30 and people are waking to this news at all different times.

00:00:32 It's ridiculously early for a Patriots livestream.

00:00:37 But if you're here, you know, and if you don't know,

00:00:40 you're going to know soon enough.

00:00:41 It's going to be-- you're going to wake up to about 775,000

00:00:46 texts from your friends, as many of you guys did.

00:00:49 And here it is.

00:00:50 It happened.

00:00:51 As was widely reported and much expected,

00:00:54 Bill Belichick and New England Patriots

00:00:56 parting ways after 24 seasons.

00:00:57 While this has been headed this way,

00:00:59 we're going to talk about everything.

00:01:01 Decision to do it, how it went down,

00:01:04 the fact that it does seem to be amicable.

00:01:06 The two sides are going to hold a press conference later

00:01:08 today, which we're going to attend.

00:01:09 We'll try to bring it to you live,

00:01:11 and we'll bring you all the reaction after.

00:01:13 A succession plan, what they should do,

00:01:15 what we think they will do.

00:01:18 And then, you know, spend some time obviously celebrating

00:01:20 what I think, you know, is--

00:01:23 I hate using the term "arguably."

00:01:25 Belichick's the best football coach who's ever coached.

00:01:28 And I don't think it's--

00:01:29 I don't think it's debatable in terms

00:01:32 of what he's done in a salary cap era

00:01:34 and his unprecedented success over this much time.

00:01:36 I think it's stupid arguing.

00:01:39 And I think when you say "arguably,"

00:01:41 you're talking about the greatest head coach

00:01:43 in any sport, any professional American sport of all time.

00:01:47 And if he's not number one, he's on the Mount Rushmore

00:01:49 of that as well.

00:01:50 And so the guy is going to get his due,

00:01:52 and he's going to get his flowers.

00:01:53 Because while this is something that I think is necessary

00:01:56 and had to change, I don't know that it's

00:01:58 instantly going to get better.

00:02:00 I think it had to change.

00:02:02 But it's still kind of a sad day for people who kind of,

00:02:06 you know, grew up in this era of Patriots football, Taylor,

00:02:09 and saw all this.

00:02:10 This was a gift given to us.

00:02:13 And this signifies the end of that.

00:02:15 And when things end, obviously, you're going to reflect.

00:02:17 And I think, you know, Belichick's tenure

00:02:19 is going to be--

00:02:22 that's going to be what we're going to think about,

00:02:24 almost right away, more than the failure, and more than the end,

00:02:27 and more than how things went down.

00:02:29 And that's not always the case with people.

00:02:31 So your initial reaction now that it's just gone,

00:02:34 like now that he's gone and now that it's happened, it's weird,

00:02:37 right?

00:02:37 It's weird waking up to a non-Bill Belichick Patriots

00:02:41 world, as you never have in your life.

00:02:44 I never have.

00:02:45 I mean, this is my first year on the beat.

00:02:47 This is crazy.

00:02:49 It's even-- it hasn't set in yet,

00:02:51 but I covered the last year of Bill Belichick's career

00:02:53 with the Patriots.

00:02:54 That's just insane.

00:02:55 I mean, I agree.

00:02:57 Like, it needed to be done.

00:02:58 I think in my head, I was already kind of ready for it.

00:03:01 I would have, frankly, been stunned if he stayed.

00:03:04 That would have been the real shocker to me.

00:03:07 But still, you can never really prepare for something like this

00:03:11 and how it feels.

00:03:12 And, you know, I mean, he's an incredible coach.

00:03:15 And you saw that, even all the issues with the offense,

00:03:18 all the issues with special teams,

00:03:20 the defense was dominant.

00:03:22 They lost their two best players and still finished top 10

00:03:25 in DVOA, which, you know, I know, stat nerd, who cares,

00:03:27 DVOA.

00:03:28 They were still a really good defense.

00:03:30 Everybody drink.

00:03:32 But, I mean, all you had to do was watch.

00:03:35 Like, you could see, this wasn't some defense

00:03:37 that was phone-knitted in.

00:03:38 This was a well-coached--

00:03:39 every week, if you watch Pass Daily,

00:03:41 and I did my behind-the-enemy-lines-type

00:03:43 segments where I would watch film with people

00:03:46 who covered other teams, every single week,

00:03:48 people were like, man, this defense, whoo.

00:03:52 Because just how well they get to their landmarks,

00:03:54 how disciplined they are, how well they

00:03:56 tackle, their recognition.

00:03:58 And the fact that when you see them playing man-covered,

00:04:01 zone-coverage, whatever it is, they always

00:04:03 seem to know exactly where to go.

00:04:05 They seem to know what's coming.

00:04:07 And that is something that players always

00:04:09 harped on with Belichick.

00:04:10 Jabril Peppers talked about it constantly,

00:04:12 how well he prepared them.

00:04:14 And it came out in the report that The Herald had

00:04:17 with Andrew Callahan, obviously, CLNS family,

00:04:20 and Doug Tide, where they interviewed somebody

00:04:22 on the staff who was like, Bill goes up in front every week

00:04:25 and tells us exactly how we need to win,

00:04:27 and we just aren't doing it.

00:04:29 And the players just aren't executing.

00:04:31 And then when he says, you do this, you'll win,

00:04:33 and you don't do this, you'll lose.

00:04:34 Well, we do the things he tells us not to do.

00:04:36 And it's pretty predictable.

00:04:38 And it didn't matter who was going to come in here.

00:04:41 There's going to be a drop-off.

00:04:44 You're hoping that it's kind of evened out

00:04:46 by the defense improving.

00:04:47 Maybe better special teams are a new philosophy

00:04:49 on special teams, and not keeping

00:04:52 eight or 10 guys who are only special teamers,

00:04:54 but aren't very good special teamers.

00:04:57 The reality is I've seen so many people on Twitter

00:05:00 make it seem like, oh, Belichick's

00:05:02 done all these good things.

00:05:02 Why would you want to let him go?

00:05:04 I think you have to be honest with yourself.

00:05:05 And this was a team that was in need of change.

00:05:07 Belichick said there were a lot of things that needed to change.

00:05:10 And he said he wanted to be a part of that.

00:05:12 But when you have Gerard Mayo, who it seems like-- it already

00:05:16 seemed that way for the past year.

00:05:18 I wasn't totally sure about it, whether he

00:05:20 was staying for personal reasons,

00:05:22 or whether it was that he expected

00:05:23 to be the heir apparent.

00:05:25 You have Gerard Mayo in waiting.

00:05:26 Obviously, Vrabel's on the market.

00:05:28 So you had options.

00:05:30 And at some point, as great as Belichick is,

00:05:32 he's going to continue to coach.

00:05:33 But he had to move on at some point.

00:05:35 It had to happen.

00:05:37 And you could have dragged your feet for another few years.

00:05:40 And maybe you had the same product.

00:05:41 And then imagine how much worse that would have been.

00:05:43 If you saw minimal change, especially in the front office,

00:05:47 where who's going to tell Bill Belichick no?

00:05:49 He said himself, yeah, he was willing to take

00:05:51 a step back in personnel.

00:05:53 But he also said that somebody needed final say.

00:05:55 That person is going to be Bill.

00:05:56 Whether you bring in Scott Pioli,

00:05:57 whether you bring in Thomas Dimitrov,

00:05:59 whether you bring in Adam Peters,

00:06:01 Bill Belichick is going to be the one at the end of the day

00:06:03 who stamps and says, yes, I approve.

00:06:06 So there had to be some level of change.

00:06:08 And it's going to be drastic.

00:06:11 It's good that you have guys like Gerard Mayo and Vrabel,

00:06:13 who are at the top of the head coaching candidates list,

00:06:16 who have familiarity with the team,

00:06:17 but also can bring their own style.

00:06:19 I don't think anybody or nobody should be expecting,

00:06:22 if it is Gerard Mayo, that it's going to be business as usual

00:06:25 the way we've seen it.

00:06:26 He is a very different person.

00:06:27 The way he addresses media is very different.

00:06:29 He's very transparent.

00:06:30 The way he addresses players, you got a players coach.

00:06:33 I think Bill is a players coach.

00:06:35 I don't want to--

00:06:36 I think that obviously players love him.

00:06:38 You've seen Mac Wilson has been tweeting about him

00:06:40 and Nick Saban for the past 24 hours,

00:06:43 because Nick Saban obviously retired yesterday.

00:06:45 Players love Bill, but players also love Gerard Mayo

00:06:48 and have a ton of respect for him.

00:06:49 He was the-- he was the leader of the defense

00:06:52 when he played as the middle linebacker.

00:06:54 He's accomplished.

00:06:55 He's going to demand immediate respect

00:06:56 and already has experience in the building.

00:06:59 But yeah, it's just--

00:07:00 I'm kind of just spewing all my thoughts, because I'm--

00:07:02 But it's all-- but it's all coming out at once, right?

00:07:05 Because that's the thing.

00:07:06 And so I think we'll move on.

00:07:08 I think we'll get to, like, hey, what happens next?

00:07:10 Because it's very interesting and strange and confusing

00:07:14 and almost scary where they go.

00:07:18 I tweeted this a short while ago.

00:07:19 I'm standing by it in the sense that I know Mike Vrabel has not

00:07:23 learned coaching under Belichick,

00:07:26 but I believe he's learned football under Belichick.

00:07:28 I believe he's cut from the same cloth.

00:07:31 And that's actually a guy who's relatively

00:07:36 young in the coaching world with kind of an old school

00:07:39 philosophy in terms of how he is.

00:07:42 He's the leader of men type of guy.

00:07:44 And not to say he's not super smart,

00:07:46 not to say he wasn't excellent.

00:07:47 I think he made a lot with a little in Tennessee,

00:07:51 and they exceeded expectations based on what

00:07:54 they had on their roster.

00:07:55 So this-- he was an excellent head coach in Tennessee.

00:07:59 But it definitely gives me pause that the start of the press

00:08:01 release when they let him go was they're

00:08:04 looking for somebody to be a little bit more

00:08:06 innovative and forward thinking.

00:08:08 Now, that could mean the forward thinking views

00:08:10 of the organization where they might need to take a step back

00:08:13 before they take a step forward.

00:08:14 And Vrabel wanted to win now.

00:08:16 But it also makes me think that they thought he was maybe

00:08:19 a bit of a dinosaur there, or maybe just

00:08:21 in terms of his thinking that it wasn't in line

00:08:23 with the direction that they wanted

00:08:24 to go in terms of analysis.

00:08:26 Go ahead.

00:08:27 Yeah, we actually-- so it was described that at first

00:08:31 it seemed like Vrabel and first year GM

00:08:34 Rankarthan didn't get along, and that they had butted heads.

00:08:37 That's what reports were.

00:08:38 Then Eeyore Appelpoort came out yesterday

00:08:41 and said that a big part of it was it's actually

00:08:43 more about ownership than the general manager--

00:08:46 or I'm sorry, than team leaders.

00:08:47 Because Vrabel never shot down rumors

00:08:50 that he wanted to be back with the Patriots.

00:08:52 Obviously, he came back after being inducted in the Patriots

00:08:55 Hall of Fame.

00:08:56 And he addressed the crowd during a game.

00:08:58 And he said, we've got a game to win,

00:09:00 which I was there, and I tweeted.

00:09:02 I was like, whoa, that was awesome, but also super bizarre

00:09:04 to see a player--

00:09:06 or to see a coach who leads a team in your conference

00:09:09 use the term "we."

00:09:11 Even if he is a former player, that's pretty strange.

00:09:14 And yeah, I guess that he didn't do anything

00:09:16 to dispel those rumors, and ownership wasn't happy with it.

00:09:18 So there's so many things flying around,

00:09:20 but you can't just poo-poo something

00:09:22 that Ian Rappaport says.

00:09:23 So that's a pretty significant part of that as well,

00:09:25 is that he had ties to the Patriots

00:09:26 and made no efforts to say, yeah, no, I

00:09:28 have no interest in going back.

00:09:29 Which is fine.

00:09:30 And so that made me think it's a fait accompli.

00:09:32 But to kind of bring my thoughtful circle,

00:09:35 fair or not fair, personally, I truly

00:09:37 believe that a clean break from all things Bill

00:09:40 and a completely new system, and new faces, and new blood,

00:09:43 and people who don't have any ties or loyalty

00:09:46 can sometimes be a good thing.

00:09:47 I know the ownership.

00:09:50 I know people want to kind of maintain the line, right?

00:09:53 Oh, the ex-coach, the ex-player.

00:09:54 And there's something to be said about that.

00:09:56 But I do think the Patriots have had such a full experience

00:10:00 over the course of 24 years with people coming in and out

00:10:03 as assistants, and this and that,

00:10:05 of having done things one way.

00:10:06 I would be interested for at least for them

00:10:09 to entertain the idea of doing something

00:10:11 totally new and different.

00:10:13 I want that new, sexy, hot thing, whatever it might be.

00:10:20 But again, I want them to at least think about it.

00:10:24 I don't like the idea of just being entrenched

00:10:26 in institutional thinking all times, and the Patriot way,

00:10:30 and this and that.

00:10:31 The Patriot way was Tom Brady and Bill Belichick.

00:10:34 That's the Patriot way.

00:10:35 Those things are gone.

00:10:36 You have to accept that it's over, right?

00:10:39 We are in a new era, and I think you have to embrace that.

00:10:42 But again, not to say Mayo or Vrabel might not be great,

00:10:48 whether it be here or somewhere else.

00:10:49 Personally, I would like the Patriots and Robert Kraft

00:10:53 to expand their thinking beyond that in their search.

00:10:55 I don't think that's going to happen.

00:10:57 I think it's basically a done deal.

00:10:58 As far as Belichick goes, going back to him,

00:11:01 I think among the things that we talked about, you and I offline

00:11:05 and we've talked about on some shows and things

00:11:08 we've had leading up to it.

00:11:10 And I know we discussed it before.

00:11:12 You kind of wrote your piece, which you guys can check out

00:11:15 on CLNS Media, talking about both Bill Belichick's

00:11:18 kind of legacy and what led to this thing

00:11:21 and all of the missteps along the way

00:11:22 over the course of the last three or four years.

00:11:24 It's certainly sad, but it's, I think,

00:11:29 deserved if you just look at the snapshot of those last four

00:11:32 years and you can't think about the past.

00:11:34 But what I always thought with Bill--

00:11:36 and you have that great Bob Phillips quote

00:11:38 that everybody talks about all the time,

00:11:40 that he can take his in and beat your in,

00:11:42 and you turn around and take your in and beat his in.

00:11:44 This is what I always thought the Bill Bel--

00:11:46 what you'll miss the most from Bill Belichick is--

00:11:49 I don't even know if you can quantify it in Vegas

00:11:52 point spreads--

00:11:53 I believe he gave you a touchdown advantage.

00:12:01 I mean, over every team.

00:12:03 If home field is three, I think Belichick gave you seven.

00:12:07 Like, I think he was-- his in-game and the game planning

00:12:11 that led up to things and the way that he would approach,

00:12:14 how he would tackle an opponent and being

00:12:16 among the first coaches that would consistently change up

00:12:19 an entire--

00:12:21 you have teams that can only do one thing well.

00:12:23 Belichick had teams that could do everything well,

00:12:25 and they could change it on a dime

00:12:28 to be able to make you play left-handed

00:12:30 or play to your weaknesses or take away what you do best.

00:12:32 And it seems obvious, but football's so complicated

00:12:37 and so intricate and takes so much planning, prep,

00:12:40 and understanding that most teams can't do that.

00:12:44 They can't change their identity week to week.

00:12:47 And the Patriots could.

00:12:48 And Bill Belichick would literally--

00:12:50 it was-- during this era, both era one and era two Taylor,

00:12:55 you'd go into games with--

00:12:57 there's a few things in sports history

00:12:59 that you knew were certain.

00:13:01 And one of them, especially in my time as a fan, one of them

00:13:04 was Pedro Martinez starts, and another one

00:13:07 was Bill Belichick walking on the field

00:13:10 and absolutely under no circumstances

00:13:12 having any chance to lose a particular game.

00:13:15 That's a weird thing in football to know

00:13:17 that there's no way this team can beat us,

00:13:19 not because there's a bunch of different things on the team

00:13:24 and Tom Brady and this and that, but because Belichick--

00:13:27 there's no way that guy over there

00:13:30 is going to come up with something that this guy over

00:13:32 here isn't going to be able to counteract

00:13:34 or isn't seven moves ahead of already

00:13:37 and has figured it out and knows what's going to happen

00:13:39 and has already accounted for that,

00:13:42 and then what you're going to do to counter that,

00:13:44 then what you're going to do to counter that.

00:13:46 And that's a massive on-field edge

00:13:49 that I think is going to be the thing that they lose

00:13:52 and it hurts them the most.

00:13:54 Yeah, yeah.

00:13:55 I mean, he's seen more football than anybody

00:13:57 who's coaching right now.

00:13:59 And that's just the bottom line.

00:14:00 And his ability to--

00:14:01 I know I started watching when I started

00:14:05 working on the top 10 piece that we're going to drop later today

00:14:09 of moments in Belichick's career.

00:14:10 I was watching the Do Your Job Well segments,

00:14:12 and I know Josh McDaniels was mentioning

00:14:14 how it was just uncanny, his ability to just kind of find

00:14:17 the vibe of a game or practice and understand

00:14:20 when to kind of turn it on and when to press guys,

00:14:23 when to pull back, what to do in terms of just game strategy.

00:14:26 And that's one of the biggest things,

00:14:28 is the ability to adjust in-game.

00:14:29 There are so many coaches, especially young coaches,

00:14:32 and as they usher in a new era, you

00:14:34 don't know how that's going to look.

00:14:36 But Bill's ability to understand the flow of a game, what

00:14:40 needed to change, how to inspire and motivate his players,

00:14:43 those are just things that not everybody has.

00:14:45 He had those in spades.

00:14:47 And it was an incredible thing to watch.

00:14:49 And then you want to talk about as a talent evaluator.

00:14:52 We can-- offense recently, yeah, kind of dropped off.

00:14:55 But the defense, how many guys did we see break out this year

00:14:58 who fans basically had as afterthoughts?

00:15:00 You think of Jelani Tavae just making plays

00:15:02 on a consistent basis, Anthony Jennings becoming

00:15:04 one of the most disruptive edge defenders in the league.

00:15:07 That obviously has to do with coaching as well

00:15:09 and position coaching.

00:15:10 And then Belichick's-- now that I'm

00:15:12 talking about position coaching, Belichick's ability

00:15:14 to find good position coaches who understood

00:15:17 how to get the most out of players,

00:15:18 even if they didn't necessarily have a background

00:15:20 in their position, or even in football.

00:15:22 Mike Pellegrino did a phenomenal job with the cornerbacks,

00:15:26 and he played lacrosse.

00:15:28 Just Belichick was so great at finding those people who

00:15:32 were great communicators and effective leaders.

00:15:35 And it's so many qualities that you--

00:15:40 some coaches have a few of these things,

00:15:42 some coaches have a few of these things.

00:15:44 Belichick just stacked all these positive qualities together.

00:15:47 And it's incredible.

00:15:50 He does.

00:15:51 And I want to address a couple of things.

00:15:54 Honestly, one thing for sure, and I know you see it in the--

00:15:59 you're seeing some in the chat, and I know some fans

00:16:01 feel this way.

00:16:03 Guys, there's two separate things.

00:16:06 You can talk about the greatness of Bill Belichick

00:16:08 and also recognizing that he needs to move on.

00:16:11 And honestly, I think--

00:16:13 look, you can argue that he needed to stay,

00:16:15 and I think it's a fair argument,

00:16:17 because you might think what's coming is worse,

00:16:19 and you would rather just live with a few more years of Bill

00:16:22 and ride it out until it's dead, dead, dead,

00:16:25 and then make the change.

00:16:26 I understand that thinking.

00:16:27 What I don't understand is thinking that, oh, you guys

00:16:30 were critical, so you can't say something nice about him.

00:16:32 Look, both things are true.

00:16:34 He's the greatest of all time, but at this point,

00:16:37 whether it's age or whether him being too entrenched

00:16:40 in whatever it is that he's thinking,

00:16:43 it's gotten to the team.

00:16:45 When you're in charge of everything,

00:16:46 you get a lot of the credit, and you know what?

00:16:49 A fair amount of the blame.

00:16:50 And so this four-year, five-year, six-year snapshot

00:16:55 in the last years of Brady, even though one of them

00:16:57 resulted in a Super Bowl and all the way to now

00:17:01 is a lot of mismanagement and a lot of things

00:17:04 and a lot of poor decisions and poor personnel decisions

00:17:07 and poor decisions with the coaching and reluctance

00:17:09 towards to accepting outside ideas or new things,

00:17:13 not embracing an analytics department.

00:17:15 I'm sorry.

00:17:16 At this point, you hate to shovel dirt on a man's grave,

00:17:21 but some things had passed Bill by, or some things were just

00:17:25 he wasn't interested in even trying.

00:17:27 And what's Bill's own philosophy?

00:17:29 You move on a year early rather than a year late.

00:17:32 He says that all the time.

00:17:34 And so he's done it, and he's been brilliant with that.

00:17:36 And we didn't even add that to his list of accomplishments.

00:17:39 Go over the list of things.

00:17:42 And one of the reasons Bill Belichick skated is everybody

00:17:44 was wrong about everything for 20 years.

00:17:48 So you just assumed you were wrong now,

00:17:50 meaning that he knew something you didn't know,

00:17:53 which of course he does.

00:17:54 He knows everything we don't know.

00:17:55 That's not really the case.

00:17:56 But really more that this will probably work out

00:17:59 because it always does.

00:18:00 You were just used to it.

00:18:01 But it's not the case anymore in this thing.

00:18:05 And you're right.

00:18:06 Sometimes you just have to move on.

00:18:07 Go over the history of Belichick's tenure,

00:18:09 how many times he let somebody go, and they're like, man,

00:18:12 that was bad.

00:18:13 First 20 years, Ahsante Samuel, end of list.

00:18:20 Not a lot.

00:18:21 You saw guys go, Trey Flowers, JC Jackson,

00:18:24 signing these big deals elsewhere.

00:18:27 And you're like, yeah, they all end up back in New England.

00:18:30 Jamie Collins, doesn't matter.

00:18:33 Because he was getting the most out of everyone.

00:18:35 He would elevate them to a point.

00:18:37 And then he would recognize when it was time to go.

00:18:39 And he was brilliant at it.

00:18:41 And recently, that wasn't as much the case.

00:18:44 There were some very questionable personnel

00:18:46 decisions.

00:18:47 The handling of Joe Tooney, as example, obviously,

00:18:53 the free agent signings.

00:18:55 There's a lot of things that--

00:18:56 Tom Brady.

00:18:57 I mean, and obviously, the Brady thing

00:18:59 is at the top, so much so it's been talked about ad nauseum.

00:19:02 It's almost not worth continuing to bring up.

00:19:04 But you know, and again, I think this comment

00:19:07 is the most appropriate.

00:19:11 GM Bill got Coach Bill fired.

00:19:14 Everybody seems to think that that's very likely the case.

00:19:17 And I think it is.

00:19:19 And that's where I think people are having a tough time

00:19:21 with the separation, Taylor.

00:19:22 It's like, you're losing that wizard on the sidelines who

00:19:26 gives you that touchdown or more edge.

00:19:29 But he no longer can take his in and beat your in.

00:19:33 Because his in is so bad because of the teams he put together

00:19:37 and what he thinks makes good football players nowadays

00:19:40 that you wonder if he's just kind of lost the plot there

00:19:42 a little bit.

00:19:43 Yeah, I mean, if we live in a world where Tom Brady stayed

00:19:47 with the Patriots, got a little bit more say,

00:19:49 and got to pick some of his own groceries,

00:19:52 Bill never gets fired.

00:19:53 He goes out on his own terms.

00:19:55 Because then it's the defense is still--

00:19:56 he gets all the credit for that.

00:19:57 Special teams, you're not going to get

00:19:59 fired over special teams.

00:20:00 But on the offense, you have Tom Brady

00:20:02 being able to lift all ships.

00:20:04 And then maybe he gets some of his pieces.

00:20:05 Then everything ends, just storybook ending.

00:20:08 But that's not what happened.

00:20:09 You know what instead, you had Brady leave.

00:20:12 And then you try to fix it.

00:20:13 Obviously, 2020 was a really weird season.

00:20:15 I don't really like holding that against it

00:20:16 because you had so many key players that

00:20:18 opted out due to COVID.

00:20:19 They had a ton of cap restrictions

00:20:21 because a lot of it had to do with Brady and the way

00:20:23 they had to kind of work things around for his contracts.

00:20:26 So then after that, you had the Mac Jones era.

00:20:28 And then it looks pretty good in 2021.

00:20:31 And then obviously, all the things

00:20:32 with the head coaching staff.

00:20:33 It's a disaster because you have an inexperienced quarterback,

00:20:36 an inexperienced quarterback coach,

00:20:37 and offensive coordinator.

00:20:38 And things just kind of fell apart.

00:20:40 And that was when you started to see--

00:20:42 I know personally, I have always or was always a in-bill-we-trust

00:20:47 guy.

00:20:48 But in 2022, you started to see, all right,

00:20:51 these decisions that you kind of expected,

00:20:53 oh, they'll make sense down the road, they weren't making sense.

00:20:56 And they were actively hurting the team.

00:20:57 And then you get to this season where, yeah, you

00:20:59 got Bill O'Brien, but you also have a mismatched coaching

00:21:02 staff where you have the old regime, Bill O'Brien

00:21:04 and a couple of his guys, and then

00:21:06 Adrian Clem, where things never really gelled.

00:21:08 Obviously, injuries were a massive part of the season

00:21:11 that I don't ever want to overlook because not having

00:21:14 Joe--

00:21:16 not having Cole Strange and Mike Inman, who

00:21:17 helped me to start the season, and then obviously,

00:21:19 Cole Strange having to battle through his injury

00:21:21 throughout the season right until the very end,

00:21:23 those were massive, massive factors

00:21:26 in the offense's inability to really ever pick up any steam.

00:21:29 And but again, the defense played well,

00:21:31 but there were just things that you couldn't ignore.

00:21:33 And it didn't really seem like there was any way

00:21:36 to fix the issues there without getting

00:21:39 a different voice in the room and somebody else who

00:21:41 was calling the shots up top.

00:21:43 So and especially with, as we mentioned,

00:21:46 even if the offense did get better,

00:21:48 it just didn't seem like a healthy situation

00:21:50 among the coaches, especially when they were clashing

00:21:52 with the front office.

00:21:53 So it stinks to say, but I do think

00:21:57 we need to look at the entire picture here

00:21:59 and that, yes, Bill, the coach, was doing a phenomenal job

00:22:02 preparing his team, motivating them, and getting them to--

00:22:05 the offense to sometimes punch above their weight

00:22:08 and the defense to keep them in games

00:22:09 that they had probably no business really being in.

00:22:12 But at the same time, the talent deficiency on offense,

00:22:15 it wasn't just this year.

00:22:16 It wasn't just last year.

00:22:17 It was all the way going back to Brady's last season.

00:22:20 It wasn't the reason that Brady left,

00:22:21 but it was a contributing factor.

00:22:23 And even when they tried to fix it

00:22:25 with the Nikhil Hari and the Mohamed Sanu,

00:22:26 obviously those ended up being disasters.

00:22:28 So we have to be honest in our evaluation

00:22:31 of why this happened, but we can also

00:22:33 acknowledge that Bill Belichick had the greatest

00:22:36 run for any coach in sports history,

00:22:38 put New England on the map in the sports world,

00:22:40 and just did so many things for not only the sports world,

00:22:44 but for the community.

00:22:45 All the joy that he was able to bring to people

00:22:48 with his victories and with all the things

00:22:50 that he did in New England.

00:22:51 So I just want to say that.

00:22:54 I think it's important to look at the big picture.

00:22:56 Yeah, and that's the thing is not

00:22:58 to get super misty and romantic about it.

00:23:01 One of the things a lot of people love about sports

00:23:04 is not just the excitement that it brings

00:23:06 when you're watching games.

00:23:07 It's bringing people together.

00:23:10 And it really is the one thing in society

00:23:12 where it doesn't matter-- where people of all races,

00:23:16 all up and down the socioeconomic scale,

00:23:19 all have this common interest and this common bond,

00:23:22 and they're united in it.

00:23:23 And you know whether you're at the game or at home,

00:23:25 there's millions of people just like you,

00:23:27 feeling what you're feeling, watching what you're watching,

00:23:29 and doing what you're doing.

00:23:30 And you have-- I mean, I think people underestimate

00:23:35 what it was like for 20-something years

00:23:38 to wake up with your chest puffed out knowing that, yeah,

00:23:41 we're the best.

00:23:43 And to have it for that long--

00:23:46 again, the whole Boston run, I think, is really insane.

00:23:49 But this span of time-- and Belichick and the Patriots,

00:23:53 Belichick and Brady launched it all with the 2001 Super Bowl.

00:23:57 And for those of us in this age bracket,

00:24:01 we went through darkness.

00:24:02 We went through a 15-year period of darkness.

00:24:05 If you were a kid in the late '80s, you got a taste.

00:24:09 And you're like, oh, cool, Larry Bird.

00:24:12 And then it went dark.

00:24:13 In my formative years, in my teens and 20s,

00:24:17 watching these teams was, wow, everybody in Boston is bad.

00:24:21 And Bill Belichick did what people

00:24:23 thought was the impossible.

00:24:24 And we'd seen token Super Bowl appearances as well.

00:24:29 And it felt like 2001 might have been another.

00:24:31 Oh, upstart guys, that's fun.

00:24:32 And they're going to lose by 40, and then you'll

00:24:34 never hear from them again.

00:24:35 And it wasn't.

00:24:36 It was the beginning.

00:24:37 And we didn't know it then.

00:24:38 We didn't know it.

00:24:40 And I always say this.

00:24:42 This happens a lot in sports, too.

00:24:44 What at the time feels like a monstrous upset,

00:24:48 you actually realize was the beginning of something.

00:24:50 You just didn't know what it was.

00:24:52 And that's what 2001 was.

00:24:54 It was the beginning.

00:24:55 Was it a big upset in retrospect,

00:24:57 looking at the Patriots and Rams?

00:24:58 Maybe a little.

00:24:59 But honestly, the Patriots were much, much, much better

00:25:02 and had so many good players on that team.

00:25:05 And then you had Belichick's just incredible game plan

00:25:09 that was able to hold the greatest show on turf at Bay.

00:25:12 And he got one for us.

00:25:13 OK, as fans, he got one.

00:25:15 And that meant everything.

00:25:17 And as much as you want to talk about, oh, it was Brady.

00:25:20 And Brady carried him, and this and that.

00:25:22 No, Bill won that Super Bowl.

00:25:26 And it was amazing for the fans and for everything

00:25:30 and then everything that followed since there.

00:25:32 So again, I think it gets lost a little bit in the now,

00:25:40 what an impact it had.

00:25:41 So I agree with you 100%.

00:25:43 Taylor, we're going to move on to next stuff.

00:25:45 We'll keep talking about Bill and his legacy.

00:25:46 And more people are flooding in here.

00:25:48 Can I say one thing real quick?

00:25:50 Because I just thought of it.

00:25:51 Is that you mentioned it?

00:25:52 I do want to say, not make it about me,

00:25:54 but quite honestly, Bill Belichick changed my life.

00:25:57 I didn't like sports at all.

00:25:58 I was just a kid who--

00:26:00 my mom threw me into a bunch of different stuff.

00:26:02 And I didn't really know what I liked or anything.

00:26:05 I went to boarding school, if you're

00:26:06 familiar with Pheasanton.

00:26:07 I went there for middle school and got

00:26:10 more familiar with the sports world

00:26:11 and started watching the Patriots.

00:26:13 I was like, this is pretty fun.

00:26:14 I've made sports, I'm so bad.

00:26:16 And now I'm here.

00:26:18 I got into sports.

00:26:19 I started really getting into trying to study the game.

00:26:22 I don't think I would have the amount of knowledge

00:26:25 in the passion for football that I do without watching Bill.

00:26:27 Because for me, it wasn't just about the winning

00:26:30 and all of that.

00:26:31 Because I started really paying attention

00:26:33 to the team in 2010 and 2011.

00:26:34 Obviously, they were good.

00:26:35 But they ended on heartbreak.

00:26:37 I think I cried after the 2011 Super Bowl loss,

00:26:39 when I was just getting on board.

00:26:41 But being able to watch how he was

00:26:43 able to hold all these great offenses, where you're

00:26:46 going into games and ESPN is previewing Peyton Manning

00:26:50 and all these offenses are juggernauts.

00:26:51 And then you see Bill Belichick hold them down.

00:26:53 And in my head, I'm like, how is he doing this?

00:26:55 And that's how I really got into football strategy

00:26:57 and wanted to study the X's and O's.

00:26:59 And then it turned into get more opportunities

00:27:02 to write, which I didn't know I ever even wanted to be a writer

00:27:05 or cover anything in any news capacity.

00:27:07 And I started studying this team.

00:27:09 And now I'm here.

00:27:11 Thank you, obviously, for the opportunity.

00:27:13 I got to actually talk to Bill and study his press conferences,

00:27:16 obviously, for years.

00:27:17 It prepared me this year to not go in there

00:27:19 and make a fool of myself.

00:27:21 But yeah, I just wanted to say, man, Bill literally

00:27:23 changed my entire life.

00:27:24 I wouldn't be here without him.

00:27:25 I don't know what I'd be doing if it weren't for him.

00:27:28 I think a lot of people's lives, Taylor.

00:27:30 And I know for someone-- younger people

00:27:33 who were inspired to do this as a professional choice,

00:27:36 like yourself, there's quite a few.

00:27:38 You can look around the beat and kind of be like, yeah,

00:27:40 there's probably a lot of these guys in here.

00:27:42 I think he did it for a lot of people.

00:27:45 And so I think it doesn't matter whether it inspired

00:27:51 you to get into it.

00:27:52 I will also say that Bill Belichick and the Patriots

00:27:54 ushered in an unprecedented era of sports

00:27:59 passion in the region.

00:28:00 Yes, it's always been a sports town.

00:28:02 But let's not-- and it always has and it always will.

00:28:07 But it became the thing about this area for 20-something

00:28:14 years.

00:28:14 And other teams had help along the way as well.

00:28:18 But the Patriots were the constant throughout all of it.

00:28:21 People come and go.

00:28:22 And the later things get--

00:28:25 there's so many different types of options.

00:28:27 And obviously, with the advent of social media

00:28:30 over the last 15 years and how things have changed

00:28:33 and all the things that you can do with your time

00:28:35 and watch and this and that.

00:28:36 And oh, people don't even watch sports anymore.

00:28:38 They watch highlights.

00:28:39 They watch the Patriots.

00:28:40 You got it Sunday and you watched it

00:28:41 because you were guaranteed to see something special

00:28:44 or something dominant.

00:28:45 And you knew you were on a march to something great.

00:28:47 And the Patriots were that line all the way through 2001,

00:28:51 all the way through till up until recently that

00:28:53 included three Red Sox titles, one Celtics--

00:28:56 four Red Sox titles, jeez--

00:28:58 one Celtics title, one Bruins title,

00:29:01 and countless other finals and championship appearances

00:29:05 from those teams.

00:29:06 Really, really amazing stuff here.

00:29:08 And I think all of us working in this business,

00:29:11 who knows what direction it goes if you

00:29:13 don't have this much interest and this much opportunity

00:29:15 and this many jobs and this sort of thing.

00:29:18 If you're just working in some middling sports town,

00:29:22 one horse town or one team town, there's

00:29:24 not as much pie to go around.

00:29:26 There is a guy who loves pie.

00:29:28 There is plenty of pie to go around here.

00:29:31 So we will definitely--

00:29:34 I think everyone is kind of grateful for this opportunity

00:29:37 to get to do what we've done and see the things I've seen.

00:29:40 I've seen five, six Super Bowls, seven Super Bowls, Taylor.

00:29:43 Losses, too.

00:29:45 That's freaking amazing.

00:29:47 That's never going to change.

00:29:48 That's there forever.

00:29:49 And I think that's that way for a lot of us.

00:29:52 We'll continue on again, a little bit of the Lovefest

00:29:54 and a little bit about what's next for sure.

00:29:57 And we'll hang in here with you guys

00:29:58 as you kind of continue to flood in,

00:30:01 learning what's happened here this morning.

00:30:03 The Patriots and Bill Belichick parted ways after 24 seasons.

00:30:06 We're going to probably chat with you for another 20

00:30:09 or so minutes.

00:30:10 Taylor has a lot to do, and I know his mind

00:30:12 is spinning towards that.

00:30:13 The Patriots, as we said, do have a press conference,

00:30:16 joint press conference.

00:30:17 So again, they're on good terms.

00:30:20 There seems to be no compensation.

00:30:22 Bill seems to be free to go where he wants to go.

00:30:26 Regardless of his contract, we'll

00:30:28 see what that decision is.

00:30:29 He can not coach and collect a big fat check next year

00:30:32 if he wants, or he can dive in to one of the seven vacancies

00:30:37 right now.

00:30:37 And you wonder if there's another team out there that

00:30:39 thinks Bill is their guy, whether there's

00:30:41 eight or nine vacancies by the time this day is over,

00:30:44 if they think they've got a shot at the goat.

00:30:47 And you never know how that's going to go.

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00:31:43 Let's circle back once again.

00:31:45 As we said, there is a press conference coming up later

00:31:49 today, which these guys are going to head over to.

00:31:52 And it is because of this.

00:31:57 Bill Belichick is gone with the Patriots after 24 seasons.

00:32:01 Now, Taylor, I'll ask quick before we

00:32:03 get on to succession plans.

00:32:05 I always thought this was the route.

00:32:08 People theorize lots of things, right?

00:32:11 Bill throws a tantrum.

00:32:12 Bill quits before he can get fired.

00:32:14 Bill puts his foot down and says, you're going to--

00:32:16 blah, blah, blah, this and that.

00:32:17 Bill poo-poos any chance of a trade.

00:32:21 Or, and there were other people who thought, well,

00:32:23 the Krauts are going to hold out.

00:32:24 They've got to get a trade, worrying

00:32:26 about what that compensation would be.

00:32:27 Is he worth the first?

00:32:28 Is he worth the second?

00:32:30 Sometimes the easiest solution and the one

00:32:33 with the least amount of-- people

00:32:34 crapped all over the Titans for thinking

00:32:36 it was too hard to work out compensation with Rabel.

00:32:39 I didn't think that was that crazy.

00:32:41 You've got to fill your job, and you

00:32:43 know there's seven vacancies out there.

00:32:45 You're going to wait a week and a half, two weeks, three weeks,

00:32:48 when every top candidate is gone,

00:32:50 to hopefully get a draft pick if somebody wants your guy.

00:32:53 That's crazy.

00:32:54 Unless it comes together fast, these things are complicated.

00:32:57 And I always thought that wasn't going to happen.

00:32:59 I thought it was almost cheap to think that you're going

00:33:01 to trade Bill after 24 years.

00:33:03 I don't think Bill wanted his value attached to a draft

00:33:08 return.

00:33:09 I don't think Bill would want to be known as the guy who was

00:33:12 traded for the Cole Strange equivalent

00:33:14 that they end up drafting with whatever pick that they get.

00:33:17 No disrespect to Cole Strange.

00:33:18 I just think they wanted to just, hey, you've done right

00:33:22 by us, we've done right by you.

00:33:24 What do you want to have happen?

00:33:25 We want to move on.

00:33:26 How do you want it to go?

00:33:27 And they gave him his option.

00:33:29 And he said, just release me from it,

00:33:31 and I'll figure it out.

00:33:32 And that's, I think, what happened here.

00:33:33 And there we go.

00:33:34 Are you surprised or upset that there

00:33:37 wasn't some sort of compensation here

00:33:39 when you do have the asset, the greatest coach of all time

00:33:42 under contract, letting him walk?

00:33:44 I know with some people might sit a little bit funny,

00:33:48 thinking like, ah, they should have gotten something out

00:33:50 of that.

00:33:51 Yeah, no, I don't think so.

00:33:52 One, realistically, would Bill also

00:33:54 want to give up high draft capital to whatever team

00:33:56 he's going to?

00:33:56 Yeah, that's another one.

00:33:57 You have to think about that as well.

00:33:58 That's not-- probably not.

00:33:59 And I think that's one of the biggest ones.

00:34:01 And I think if you did add that to the equation,

00:34:05 it turns this amicable parting of ways

00:34:07 into something that's turned a little bit--

00:34:09 And that's how coach trades work.

00:34:11 The coach has to say, I'll go there.

00:34:13 It's not like players that you ship them.

00:34:15 They've got to agree.

00:34:16 All you're doing is saying, I will free him for this contract.

00:34:19 And then later, you're going to send me something.

00:34:21 But it's basically a--

00:34:22 it's letting somebody seek out their own job

00:34:25 and then working out some sort of compensation after.

00:34:27 But he's got to want it.

00:34:28 Patriots did not hold as many cards in this regard

00:34:31 as you guys-- as people think, that they could just ship him.

00:34:34 And so there's a lot of reasons, the one you just mentioned also

00:34:36 being another huge one.

00:34:38 Why would Bill say, trade me for two first,

00:34:40 and then go somewhere else and not have--

00:34:42 if you're a team looking for a head coach,

00:34:44 chances are you need every draft pick you can possibly get.

00:34:47 So you're kneecapping yourself right out of the gate.

00:34:49 It does not make sense.

00:34:51 Yeah, and this is the situation with the Jets,

00:34:53 where he was traded to the Patriots from the Jets,

00:34:55 but he had no legacy.

00:34:56 I mean, obviously, coach with the Jets.

00:34:58 But he wasn't Bill Belichick yet.

00:34:59 So that trade made a little more sense.

00:35:01 But with someone with his legacy--

00:35:03 also, I made a joke about the whole wanting

00:35:07 to move on from Bravo and not really spend the time it would

00:35:10 take to find a trade candidate.

00:35:12 I made fun of it just because it was an easy joke.

00:35:14 But realistically, that makes total sense.

00:35:16 And you do want to move on quickly.

00:35:18 We don't really know for sure what their succession plan is,

00:35:20 if it's going to be Mayo, if it's going to be Vrabel,

00:35:22 if it's going to be Brian Flores, for all we know.

00:35:24 But I do think this is something you kind of want

00:35:26 to make your decision, start moving on, and not just make

00:35:29 it messy.

00:35:29 And I agree with your point also that if you do end up

00:35:33 trading Bill for a pick, it does get associated

00:35:35 with whoever's taken.

00:35:37 Obviously, that could be, oh, we got

00:35:38 a new face of the franchise, and the first new

00:35:40 pushes us into a new era.

00:35:42 Or it could be a pick that's totally blown,

00:35:44 and then it just looks really bad for the organization

00:35:48 or for Bill.

00:35:49 And yeah, I just agree.

00:35:50 I don't think that trading was ever really a possibility.

00:35:52 It sounds great as a fan because you

00:35:54 want as much draft capital as possible

00:35:56 in what's pretty much a rebuild.

00:35:57 But yeah, I don't think that was ever really on the table.

00:36:00 Yeah, likely not.

00:36:02 So again, moving on to the succession,

00:36:05 here's another thing.

00:36:06 Look, I made my case, so to speak, about new voices.

00:36:14 I at least want to be open to them.

00:36:15 I don't like the idea of just being--

00:36:17 but I believe it's very likely that it's going to be--

00:36:22 I think it's a two-horse race, and one

00:36:24 might be so far ahead right now that it's really one person.

00:36:29 And that's Gerard Mayo.

00:36:30 I know Vrabel is also a strong possibility,

00:36:34 but between those two, that seems

00:36:36 likely where we're headed.

00:36:37 Whether this ends up being a great hire or not,

00:36:40 there are reports, and I think even just people openly

00:36:43 talking about how much people love Gerard Mayo in the room,

00:36:47 leader of men.

00:36:48 And as I've mentioned, I was fortunate enough

00:36:50 to get to know Gerard a little bit when

00:36:52 I was working over at NBC.

00:36:54 And he was doing football programming with us

00:36:57 after his playing days were over.

00:36:59 And just one of the smartest, funniest, most engaging guys,

00:37:03 magnetic personality, walks in a room

00:37:05 and everybody wants to be around him.

00:37:07 Smile on his face for everyone, treats everybody with respect,

00:37:10 knows your name, looks you in the eye,

00:37:13 shares stories, holds court, and everybody just sits there

00:37:17 and wants to listen to it.

00:37:18 So even the teeny taste I've gotten in my time

00:37:22 or my year or so working with him, I can say,

00:37:25 there's a lot of reasons to like the vibe

00:37:28 that Gerard Mayo puts out.

00:37:29 What translates on the field in terms of strategy,

00:37:32 who you hire, being able to run a whole football team,

00:37:35 that's a daunting task for someone

00:37:36 who's never done it before.

00:37:37 So there's some risk involved there.

00:37:39 But I like the idea of not necessarily just--

00:37:42 I definitely don't want some 70-year-old retread

00:37:45 coach who's done it, who's on his fourth job,

00:37:48 like just for the sake of doing it.

00:37:50 So there's that for sure as a potential thing.

00:37:57 Whether the choice is right or not, another thing I don't love

00:37:59 is Bill Belichick is not being let go because of his coaching.

00:38:06 And we're worried about who's succeeding him as coach.

00:38:08 The real issue is who's making personnel decisions, which

00:38:13 if they had gone differently over the last few years,

00:38:16 if you had taken Debo over Nakeel and Pickens over Thornton

00:38:20 and not taken Cole Strange and not traded around the board

00:38:24 and not drafted special teams as early

00:38:25 and built a little bit more depth in a bench,

00:38:28 this might have been a 9 or 10 win team this year.

00:38:30 We're not even entertaining Bill.

00:38:32 We're talking about where you go next.

00:38:34 I don't know how that would necessarily go.

00:38:36 The personnel is the issue.

00:38:38 I do not love putting a coach in place

00:38:41 and then looking around and be like, anyone

00:38:42 want to work with this guy?

00:38:44 I find it backwards.

00:38:45 And I know that's how it works.

00:38:46 It's really hard to get the GM in here

00:38:50 and then have them do a round of coach interviews.

00:38:52 The timing is weird.

00:38:54 But this is one of the weird things

00:38:55 when you have a guy who is both.

00:39:00 When they're both, it's hard to replace the GM

00:39:02 and do it first at a time when you're also

00:39:05 looking for a head coach.

00:39:06 But that's the situation they're in here.

00:39:09 And they're kind of taking what I think is the easy route,

00:39:12 which is, yeah, I already got the guy in a building.

00:39:14 I've got what I need right here.

00:39:16 That's good.

00:39:17 Come on in and do it.

00:39:18 That's a big part of your organizational philosophy

00:39:21 as a person who's running the team, Taylor.

00:39:24 Your coach has to jive with it.

00:39:26 And now you're taking that choice away from them.

00:39:29 And I think you're handicapping, kneecapping your opportunity

00:39:33 to get somebody.

00:39:34 Yeah, I mean, if it is Drodd-Mayo,

00:39:36 I think with Drodd and Vrabel, I think

00:39:39 that's the smoothest course to maybe finding

00:39:40 that general manager.

00:39:41 Like with Vrabel, it was reported

00:39:43 that it's not that they are handcuffed together,

00:39:45 he and Adam Peters.

00:39:47 But they do have both ties to the Patriots.

00:39:50 So I'm not sure if he would still go with Mayo as well.

00:39:52 But with Mayo, I still think that when

00:39:55 I asked him a few weeks ago about how

00:39:57 does your experience outside of football

00:39:59 kind of help you as a leader and as a potential head coach.

00:40:01 And he mentioned how he's able to communicate

00:40:04 with people of all different types of backgrounds

00:40:06 and all these things.

00:40:06 And obviously, you have experience with him.

00:40:08 So I agree that it is kind of funky

00:40:11 when you have to get your coach and then you

00:40:13 have to get the general manager.

00:40:14 But I do feel like if there's anybody who

00:40:17 would be able to find someone and really understand what

00:40:20 would be a healthy relationship and someone

00:40:22 they could really work with, I do

00:40:23 think that Mayo was probably one of those guys,

00:40:25 just because of that outside ability.

00:40:27 And like I said, with Vrabel, it seems like he and Adam Peters

00:40:29 might end up being a package deal just because of their

00:40:33 shared history with the Patriots and that Adam Peters is probably

00:40:36 going to be the head coach.

00:40:37 And Mike Vrabel, I think he does want some level of say

00:40:41 in the personnel decisions.

00:40:42 But if he and Adam Peters are on the same page,

00:40:45 that could potentially work.

00:40:46 So yeah, I still have to do my dive in.

00:40:50 But you're entrusting-- this is the most

00:40:52 important draft since Bledsoe.

00:40:56 You are in a position you never find yourself in.

00:41:00 And you can debate Drew Bledsoe's career,

00:41:04 but at that point, that was a home run pick

00:41:06 to put the Patriots back on the map.

00:41:08 You don't get that one right.

00:41:09 If you had the guy--

00:41:10 again, it was Bledsoe or Rick Myhrer,

00:41:14 and they were considered to be neck and neck for the one

00:41:16 and the two.

00:41:17 You pick wrong, you pick Myhrer, there's no next, maybe.

00:41:21 You don't know where you go from there.

00:41:24 Bledsoe put New England back on the map

00:41:26 after being absolute bottom feeders in the early '90s

00:41:32 sort of situation, gets them back to a Super Bowl,

00:41:35 gets you Parcells, which eventually gets you to Carroll,

00:41:39 gets you to Belichick, and then gets you to where you are here.

00:41:42 But you have no idea the direction the franchise goes.

00:41:44 You're talking about, at the minimum,

00:41:47 this pick alters the course.

00:41:49 This pick and this draft and this offseason

00:41:52 alters the trajectory of the franchise

00:41:54 for a minimum three, four years and possibly longer.

00:41:58 So it is the most important thing

00:42:02 the franchise has done in decades.

00:42:05 And it's weird to think, I'll get to that part later.

00:42:09 But that's the odd part to me, is you see these teams already

00:42:13 out there, and your reports have reached out

00:42:16 to this assistant GM candidate and this personnel guy

00:42:19 and this guy for interviews and interviews.

00:42:21 There's teams looking for executives too.

00:42:22 Don't you kind of have to get involved here fast

00:42:25 and then make sure that those people are cool with Gerrard?

00:42:30 No, absolutely.

00:42:31 But I think there's also--

00:42:32 I mean, there's a lot of teams that are in this position.

00:42:34 Again, it is awkward, but this is kind of the position

00:42:37 they're in.

00:42:37 At least they do have their head coach.

00:42:39 And they have somebody who--

00:42:40 like you mentioned yourself, where the defense wasn't

00:42:43 the problem here.

00:42:43 And I think the best thing to do is

00:42:45 to try to carry over as much from the defense as possible.

00:42:47 I don't know if the Belichicks are going to leave the staff.

00:42:50 So I mean, I understand what you're saying.

00:42:53 You want to have that person with a vision for how the team

00:42:56 is going to go from here on out.

00:42:57 But as I mentioned on our post-game show last week,

00:43:00 I don't think this is so bad of a roster

00:43:03 where you legitimately have to just completely uproot

00:43:05 everything.

00:43:06 The defense is good.

00:43:07 The offense has pieces.

00:43:09 You need to add three or four starters where you say, OK,

00:43:13 I'm comfortable with these guys really pushing us

00:43:15 into the area.

00:43:16 And with the draft capital they have and the money they have,

00:43:18 they are in position to do it.

00:43:20 So I agree.

00:43:21 I'm also looking at Albert Breer.

00:43:22 He had a list of hot names for potentially filling

00:43:26 a general manager spot.

00:43:27 A lot of them have Patriots ties.

00:43:29 You have Mark Borgonzi, who I pronounced that well,

00:43:34 the assistant general manager for the Chiefs.

00:43:35 He was with the Chiefs back in 2009 with Scott Pioli.

00:43:38 So he's got some Patriots ties.

00:43:39 Trey Brown, he has ties to Gerard Mayo as well.

00:43:43 He's currently the senior personnel executive

00:43:45 for the Cincinnati Bengals.

00:43:46 He's a name to watch.

00:43:48 Obviously, as we mentioned, Adam Peters.

00:43:50 Jim Nagy, who's the executive director for the senior bowl.

00:43:52 Now, I'm not sure if he's going to want to leave.

00:43:54 That's a bit of a stretch.

00:43:55 But he's on the list.

00:43:56 So he's someone who could also watch

00:43:57 because he used to be a scout for the Patriots.

00:43:59 So-- oh, also, Elliot Wolfe, director

00:44:02 of scouting for the Patriots.

00:44:03 We don't know if maybe he takes a bigger role.

00:44:06 So it's not a great position to be in.

00:44:08 But it's also great that the Patriots have a pipeline.

00:44:10 Their coaching pipeline isn't great.

00:44:12 But their scouting pipeline is pretty fantastic.

00:44:14 A lot of guys who've had success in the league

00:44:16 and built great teams.

00:44:17 As I said, the Bengals, Chiefs, and 49ers.

00:44:19 You have guys with Patriots ties who are all looking

00:44:22 to become general managers.

00:44:23 So not the best position in the world in your perspective.

00:44:27 And as you said, it kind of worked backwards.

00:44:29 But it's not like they have to go out and get

00:44:30 completely fresh blood.

00:44:31 And with the Crafts, we know they

00:44:33 like to keep things in-house.

00:44:34 They like to have some level of continuity with people

00:44:37 they've worked with before.

00:44:38 I do think they're in a decent position.

00:44:40 Let me ask you this.

00:44:41 This is another thing I think was

00:44:44 intended to provide stability and assurance and to keep--

00:44:49 what was that face for?

00:44:51 Somebody-- Mr. Jason Martin, first year reporter,

00:44:54 feeling on the roster.

00:44:55 I've been covering this team for a lot longer than that, friend.

00:44:58 I've been studying this team for a lot longer than that.

00:45:00 So know your role.

00:45:02 Taylor's the Doogie Howser of the Patriots beat, OK?

00:45:04 And again, I'm dating myself with that reference.

00:45:07 But he's got a PhD, my friends.

00:45:10 So don't worry about this.

00:45:13 This is the wrong man to go toe-to-toe with over

00:45:15 particulars, I'll tell you that.

00:45:16 Here's another thing I'm going to say about the Mayo

00:45:19 situation, a potential landmine Robert Craft created

00:45:23 for himself.

00:45:25 It was designed, both the O'Brien and the Mayo,

00:45:30 kind of call them promotions or kind of installing them

00:45:35 into prominent positions on this team,

00:45:37 where it's kind of a pushback from Craft to Bill on, dude,

00:45:41 we can't keep doing this no OC thing.

00:45:43 And you got to elevate people within the organization

00:45:47 that we want to keep here.

00:45:48 We're going to lose these guys.

00:45:49 The brain drain is significant.

00:45:51 And you felt it this year.

00:45:54 And again, Andrew Callahan and Doug Kyd and Harold

00:45:56 detailed some of the behind the scenes stuff

00:45:58 with the coaching staffs about maybe guys not necessarily

00:46:02 doing what they need to do or the wrong positions.

00:46:04 And obviously, it all came to a head the year before

00:46:06 with Matt Patricia and Joe Judge,

00:46:08 totally out of their depth, trying to run an offense

00:46:10 and coach up a second year quarterback.

00:46:12 And I think that, as you wrote in your piece,

00:46:15 was probably the biggest thing that kind of got you to here,

00:46:19 where you went from semi-competitive

00:46:23 to the third worst team in the entire NFL.

00:46:27 That was hard to do.

00:46:28 And that's how they got there.

00:46:30 So the idea was, I just don't want

00:46:32 to lose any more of these guys.

00:46:33 So let's bring in a qualified outside guy

00:46:35 rather than your second string tight ends coach as the OC.

00:46:41 And let's give Gerard some assurances

00:46:44 that he means something to us.

00:46:46 And he's here.

00:46:46 And in fact, he basically was anointed without a position

00:46:50 as Bill Belichick's successor, walking around the building

00:46:54 before--

00:46:56 forget the corpse being cold.

00:46:57 The guy's still alive.

00:46:59 And he's sitting there.

00:47:01 And Bill knows he's about to-- this

00:47:03 is the guy who's taking my job.

00:47:05 Bill doesn't really give him any extra power.

00:47:07 He doesn't make him DC.

00:47:08 Gerard Mayo's title remained linebacker's coach,

00:47:11 despite Robert Kraft kind of saying,

00:47:14 this is kind of the successor, the succession plan.

00:47:18 And I believe Kraft did it for two reasons.

00:47:21 The stability one.

00:47:22 But the second one was, when Bill is finally done,

00:47:27 and the assumption was always, Bill's

00:47:29 going to eventually just decide, I'm going to move on.

00:47:32 When the record's broken and he decides

00:47:34 he doesn't want to do this anymore,

00:47:36 he just hands the keys over to this guy,

00:47:38 and we have continuity.

00:47:40 But now you have continuity, whether you want it or not.

00:47:42 Or worse, you have a situation where

00:47:45 if you changed your thinking over the course of the last 12

00:47:49 months, and you don't know if Mayo's the guy,

00:47:52 and you don't want him to lead this post-trainwreck Bill

00:47:55 experience, and say you do, you're like, oh, man,

00:47:58 I never thought Vrabel was going to be available,

00:48:01 and that's the guy I want.

00:48:03 How do you bring him in here at this point?

00:48:07 Is Gerard going to be like, yeah, cool,

00:48:09 I'll be DC under this guy?

00:48:10 No freaking way.

00:48:12 And again, how many people, how many players

00:48:15 might you lose with that who have determined that,

00:48:18 like, I like this guy, and I would play for this guy.

00:48:21 And you bring in some other dude,

00:48:23 even if they like and respect him as well,

00:48:26 that's going to be a little weird.

00:48:27 So you've set yourself up for a position

00:48:30 where you almost have to give it to Mayo

00:48:33 or have to completely wipe it out.

00:48:36 And so I don't know.

00:48:37 It's going to be messy.

00:48:40 It's a messy situation.

00:48:42 Yeah.

00:48:44 My only real hesitation with Mayo

00:48:46 was the inexperience, obviously, especially

00:48:49 when Vrabel is on the market.

00:48:50 It's one thing if you're saying, OK,

00:48:52 you want to retain someone who has

00:48:54 experience with the team where Gerard Mayo, it's like, yes,

00:48:57 it's him.

00:48:57 You kind of just deal with it if he is inexperienced.

00:49:00 When it was Vrabel, I was on record

00:49:02 as kind of taking a step back and being like, OK,

00:49:05 especially if he's handcuffed with Adam Peters, that kind of

00:49:08 seems like a no-brainer.

00:49:09 He was the coach of the year two years ago.

00:49:11 Obviously had success when he had a decent roster,

00:49:14 turned Ryan Tannehill into a pro bowler.

00:49:17 He has a track record.

00:49:18 But at the same time, Mayo has been a hot head coach

00:49:21 candidate for years.

00:49:23 And if you think-- the inexperience,

00:49:24 that's just part of it.

00:49:25 At some point, the guy's got to get an opportunity.

00:49:27 At some point, somebody had to give Bill Belichick

00:49:29 an opportunity.

00:49:29 So I understand that there's a lot of question marks.

00:49:34 But at the same time, I do think it's great

00:49:36 that you have somebody who can see how Belichick ran things

00:49:39 and take all the things that were successful,

00:49:41 which I think he'll do, and then put his own spin on it.

00:49:44 Where you had Trent Brown.

00:49:45 I had Dakota Randall on a couple of days ago.

00:49:48 And he talked about how Trent was pissed off

00:49:50 because he heard from coaches that they were devising ways

00:49:54 to basically screw with him because they wanted

00:49:56 to see what his commitment was.

00:49:57 And there was also the issue of scheduling,

00:50:00 where the Patriots keep you on your toes.

00:50:01 And sometimes you don't get your schedule till the day before.

00:50:04 Same thing with media, which is a maddening,

00:50:06 where we don't know what time we're

00:50:07 supposed to be going in until 8 o'clock the night before.

00:50:09 And sometimes it makes sense.

00:50:11 But then Trent Brown made the fair point of, OK,

00:50:13 well, when it's the bye week and I want

00:50:14 to spend time with my family, you're

00:50:15 forcing me to buy these tickets and things

00:50:17 when they're the most expensive, last minute.

00:50:19 That's not cool.

00:50:20 Now you have somebody in charge, whether it's Mayo

00:50:23 or whether it's Avrebel, where they can toe that line.

00:50:26 Where they have been in the players' shoes

00:50:28 in a Patriots system.

00:50:29 Where they know, hey, this worked.

00:50:31 And now that I'm a coach, I understand

00:50:33 what Bill was thinking.

00:50:35 As opposed to, yeah, no, that was jacked up.

00:50:37 I don't agree.

00:50:37 I don't think that was OK.

00:50:39 And you get that fresh perspective.

00:50:41 So frankly, I'm excited.

00:50:43 I really don't want them to completely gut this team

00:50:45 and act like Bill was never here.

00:50:47 I don't think that's how you win.

00:50:48 Because as we keep saying, Bill the coach was not the problem.

00:50:51 Bill the GM was the problem.

00:50:53 We're going to see how they handle the general manager

00:50:55 situation.

00:50:55 But I think it's really exciting to potentially get

00:50:58 a guy who has both perspectives of not having--

00:51:01 with Mayo having worked and played for Bill,

00:51:03 but with Avrebel having played for Bill

00:51:04 and had success as a coach elsewhere.

00:51:06 You're not wrong at all about any of it.

00:51:09 It's just, if you stay in-house, chances

00:51:11 are you're going to keep--

00:51:14 is Mayo going to fire the entire staff and bring in his own guys?

00:51:17 Does he have the cachet to have guys?

00:51:20 You haven't coached with other people before.

00:51:24 What kind of staff can he assemble?

00:51:26 What I don't want is 70% of it is coming back, maybe 80%

00:51:31 with a couple of other things.

00:51:32 That's the same team with a worse head coach.

00:51:35 That's not great.

00:51:37 And we're not saying-- and again, it's not a knock on Mayo.

00:51:41 But again, what happened was--

00:51:43 again, this is Bill's both--

00:51:47 this is how he did it.

00:51:48 Everything Bill Belichick did that made him successful

00:51:51 is also what he's done that's led him to this point.

00:51:54 And you and I have talked about this a bit in the weeks,

00:51:58 months leading up here.

00:52:00 Consistently building up and training your own people

00:52:03 and rising them up to a level of prominence

00:52:05 where they can move on and get other NFL jobs is great.

00:52:09 And I know Bill didn't want to hire the hot OC or DC

00:52:13 from somewhere just knowing that those guys want to go out

00:52:15 and get head coaching jobs somewhere else.

00:52:17 And it's one of the reasons why he made you earn that title

00:52:20 and want to stick around here.

00:52:21 And he doesn't like constantly changing things up.

00:52:23 He'd rather just have a program.

00:52:25 Bill very much views this as a college program

00:52:28 talking about the Patriots.

00:52:29 And honestly, it's one of the reasons a lot of teams

00:52:32 and a lot of new head coaches fail in their first stops

00:52:35 is they don't have enough time to build their program.

00:52:38 But right now, because of that, you

00:52:41 lost your top tier and your second tier guys

00:52:45 and are putting guys who played minimally

00:52:47 on the other side of the ball in charge of other positions.

00:52:51 It really is across the board, not to call out names,

00:52:58 but it really needs, I think, a fairly significant overhaul

00:53:02 in the assistance.

00:53:03 On top of that, the Patriots operate--

00:53:07 and especially you lose Ross Douglas during the year

00:53:09 as well-- Patriots operated with far fewer assistants.

00:53:12 I forget what the number is, but it's like 16, 17,

00:53:15 and the Niners, for example, have like 29.

00:53:19 They have fewer guys doing it.

00:53:21 You have some guys doubling up.

00:53:24 Matt Patricia was technically an O-line coach last year

00:53:27 and the offensive coordinator.

00:53:29 And he's like, what are you guys doing?

00:53:30 OK, how about you guys?

00:53:31 Are you guys good?

00:53:32 And you've got position players basically

00:53:35 running their own units and their own teams

00:53:37 and things like that.

00:53:38 None of that is good.

00:53:39 So you have to be able to come in and build something

00:53:43 from scratch.

00:53:44 And again, maybe Mayo does.

00:53:46 Maybe Mayo is such a liked guy that he's got 100 people who

00:53:49 are coming in.

00:53:49 Do a lot of people with experience

00:53:52 want to work on the staff of a less experienced guy?

00:53:56 I don't know.

00:53:57 It's a little tricky there.

00:54:00 But I think-- I mean, you also have

00:54:02 to assume that Mayo has already thought about this for years.

00:54:05 Again, he was taking--

00:54:06 I think it was two years ago he interviewed with the Broncos.

00:54:10 I'm sure he has some people where

00:54:11 he understood if he was ever in this position,

00:54:13 especially if he did know that he basically

00:54:15 was going to be the head coach after Bill.

00:54:17 He's got to have a plan.

00:54:18 He's got to have a plan to circle who he's-- exactly.

00:54:20 And on top of that, you also have Bill O'Brien.

00:54:21 If he doesn't get rid of Bill O'Brien--

00:54:23 But there's so many vacancies.

00:54:23 That's the thing.

00:54:24 It's like seven vacancies and a bunch of people

00:54:27 are going to be moving around here.

00:54:29 It's going to be a massive grab and go.

00:54:34 It's like an Easter egg hunt.

00:54:37 You throw them all out there and say, go.

00:54:39 Everyone's going to be scrambling to get that.

00:54:41 So that's a challenge, too.

00:54:41 But you're right.

00:54:42 He's definitely thought about it.

00:54:44 Yeah, and if the crowds are going

00:54:45 to put him in this position, I think, one,

00:54:47 just out of fairness, if he wasn't ready,

00:54:49 I don't think they would make him that coach.

00:54:51 And if he didn't come to them and say, hey,

00:54:53 I've got some guys that I really like,

00:54:55 and I'm sure they have to do their interviews anyway.

00:54:57 They have to make sure that they have to abide by the Rooney rule,

00:55:01 which I absolutely hate.

00:55:03 But they're going to have to interview candidates.

00:55:05 And if they start looking at other people,

00:55:07 even if they do really like Jarrod, and they realize, oh,

00:55:09 God, maybe he isn't quite ready because he doesn't have

00:55:12 a staff in place, or what have you,

00:55:14 I'm sure that'll be part of the decision making.

00:55:16 And then that's where Mike Vrabel comes in.

00:55:18 And then it's, OK, well, he does have experience.

00:55:19 He has people he's worked with.

00:55:21 He probably has people he can bring with him.

00:55:23 But that's so much speculation, because we literally will not

00:55:26 have any idea about any of that.

00:55:28 Obviously, Arthur Smith is on the market for Vrabel

00:55:31 in terms of if he wants to gut the Patriots coaching staff,

00:55:34 they have that.

00:55:34 But yeah, I'm sure that whoever the head coach is,

00:55:39 they will have people in mind and people on call

00:55:41 to bring with them.

00:55:42 Yeah.

00:55:43 Otherwise, it's just negligence on the crowd's part.

00:55:45 And I don't think they run that way, because if there's

00:55:48 one thing the Crafts have done pretty well,

00:55:49 it's find head coaches.

00:55:50 They went from Bill Barcellos to Pete Carroll to Bill Belichick.

00:55:54 That's a pretty damn good track record.

00:55:55 Pete Carroll's resume looked better after the fact.

00:55:58 His time here was a little bit stumbling and bumbling

00:56:01 with the Patriots.

00:56:02 And he got whacked after an 8-8 season.

00:56:05 So it wasn't like it was a total fail.

00:56:08 But they didn't like--

00:56:09 It was good instinct.

00:56:10 They didn't like the way he was--

00:56:11 they didn't like the direction he was taking things.

00:56:13 And he might have--

00:56:14 He's very well done.

00:56:15 It's amazing, though, his enthusiasm and his success

00:56:19 that he's had after.

00:56:19 Pete Carroll's going to go down as both one of the better

00:56:24 NFL coaches, certainly, of this era,

00:56:27 and also one of the greatest college coaches of all time.

00:56:29 He's had a remarkable career since he left here.

00:56:32 He might have been--

00:56:34 and this was also his second head coaching gig.

00:56:38 But it really-- it wasn't perfect then.

00:56:41 But you're right.

00:56:42 That line of coaches is insane when you look at it now.

00:56:46 And the resume that they have is really incredible.

00:56:50 And in fairness to Pete, he was a little ahead of his time.

00:56:52 The whole Seattle Legion of Boom thing,

00:56:54 he had been doing that at USC.

00:56:56 And that was something that he'd believed in for a long time.

00:56:59 He just finally had the pieces to do it.

00:57:00 And a lot of the time with head coaches,

00:57:02 especially if you're not like a Bill Belichick, where

00:57:04 you get to pick who's on your team,

00:57:06 sometimes you just don't have the supporting cast

00:57:08 to do what you want to do.

00:57:09 I was not even alive when Pete Carroll was head coach

00:57:11 of the Patriots.

00:57:13 I don't know.

00:57:13 But clearly, he had something cooking.

00:57:15 But yeah, the track record in hindsight is insane.

00:57:18 Yeah.

00:57:20 Real quick, I want to go back to something

00:57:22 that you talked about.

00:57:23 If Mayo appears to be the leading candidate,

00:57:27 another name that was floated and has been floated

00:57:29 and is gaining a little bit of traction

00:57:31 here on Twitter as people are talking about guys

00:57:33 they'll talk to is also Brian Flores, which

00:57:36 would be interesting.

00:57:37 And again, another person with Patriots ties,

00:57:39 learned under Bill, had coaching experience.

00:57:43 Defense was phenomenal when he was here.

00:57:46 Obviously, a successful stint in Miami,

00:57:48 but just didn't get along with his bosses.

00:57:51 Probably deserved a little--

00:57:52 And Tua.

00:57:53 Yeah, and Tua wasn't on board.

00:57:55 And look, there's reasons why that ended the way it did.

00:57:58 And it didn't end well.

00:58:00 But he did a good job there.

00:58:02 And he was an instant leader of men also and had a good vision,

00:58:05 even though it didn't necessarily jive with what ownership was

00:58:08 trying to do at the time.

00:58:09 And you know what?

00:58:10 He wasn't wrong.

00:58:12 This is almost a Vrabel situation

00:58:13 of what got him whacked is they want to do something else.

00:58:16 And there's a push and pull between that.

00:58:20 Flores was right.

00:58:21 Tua did not give them the best chance to win that year.

00:58:23 And he was forced to play him because the organization was

00:58:26 looking ahead not to, can we make the playoffs

00:58:29 and lose in the first round this year?

00:58:30 That wasn't as important to them as developing the asset.

00:58:34 And something has to be said for that.

00:58:36 Because sometimes, OK, the coach wants to win right now.

00:58:41 And that's always going to be the case.

00:58:42 But to tell them that it actually doesn't matter,

00:58:46 we're taking the long view.

00:58:47 We want to be good for years, not just now.

00:58:50 And if you stunt this guy's growth by jerking him around

00:58:53 and pulling him out and putting this shaggy 40-year-old dude

00:58:56 in there in place of him, fine, maybe you're

00:58:59 like 10% better on the field.

00:59:01 But that could hurt us for years.

00:59:02 So I understand that as well.

00:59:04 But Flores is a name--

00:59:05 the reason I brought that up, because I wanted you to address

00:59:08 Flores' potential candidacy and whether or not

00:59:10 you think he is an interesting candidate for you.

00:59:14 But second, you'd been a Mayo guy all along.

00:59:18 And then you did a podcast yesterday.

00:59:20 And you came out of it and kind of flipped and said,

00:59:21 you know what?

00:59:22 Yeah, I think it was with Dakota Randall from Nessun,

00:59:26 who also had an excellent piece recently about Trent Brown.

00:59:30 But Dakota sold you on Vrabel.

00:59:33 Where are you now?

00:59:34 Because I'm not going to call you impulsive.

00:59:37 But you do jump around a little bit.

00:59:39 Because you get-- you know why?

00:59:41 Because you're excitable.

00:59:42 Because you have a positive attitude.

00:59:44 And you can be convinced why to like things.

00:59:48 And I think he convinced you why to like Vrabel,

00:59:50 not necessarily to prefer him.

00:59:52 But he did sell you on the merits of Vrabel as a coach.

00:59:55 Yeah, and I mean, there was a lot going on in that.

00:59:59 So part of it-- and also I want to mention with Flores,

01:00:01 before I forget, he also turned that Vikings defense around.

01:00:04 That Vikings defense was horrendous two years ago.

01:00:08 And he really-- or last year.

01:00:09 And he made them a respectable unit

01:00:11 that was legitimately competitive and one

01:00:12 of the NFL's best defenses.

01:00:14 So I want to throw that out there.

01:00:15 But the reason I kind of did a bit of a step back on Mayo

01:00:18 was one, Dakota did mention how Greg Bedard talked about it.

01:00:23 We don't know this for a fact.

01:00:24 But he did say that people thought

01:00:26 that Gerard Mayo wasn't ready.

01:00:28 And when you compare that with the whole thing

01:00:30 with the reports on Adam Peters and Vrabel and Peters

01:00:32 maybe coming together, that was like, OK,

01:00:35 my only hesitation with Mayo is if he truly isn't ready.

01:00:38 If they think he's ready, then yeah,

01:00:39 I know it's his first year as head coach.

01:00:41 But he's got to have a first year as head coach

01:00:42 to become a head coach.

01:00:43 So that was where I was hesitant.

01:00:46 But if the crafts are saying and reports are coming out

01:00:48 that Mayo's at the top of the list for them, then yeah.

01:00:51 Now, because we didn't have that confirmation.

01:00:53 We had the-- we know that Gerard Mayo isn't waiting.

01:00:55 But the most recent news that we had had

01:00:58 was Bedard's report that people didn't think he was

01:01:00 ready to become a head coach.

01:01:01 I believe that came from coach--

01:01:03 I believe that came-- I believe that came

01:01:06 from coaches, not players.

01:01:07 That's my belief.

01:01:09 And that also could be some people are like,

01:01:11 this guy's walking around like he's the anointed one.

01:01:14 He's just a position coach.

01:01:16 And I think I'm going to fault Belichick a little bit for that

01:01:18 without giving him true power and authority that

01:01:22 was commensurate with basically the way he was viewed

01:01:26 by ownership in the organization.

01:01:28 I don't think Bill let him kind of lead.

01:01:31 And so I think--

01:01:32 Yeah, totally, sir.

01:01:34 I just wanted to interject that.

01:01:35 So that's my take on where that came from.

01:01:37 I'm not going to call it a straight up hit piece.

01:01:39 But I do understand why some people

01:01:41 might have been put off by it.

01:01:44 I don't know whether it means that's

01:01:46 an accurate representation of how Mayo is actually viewed

01:01:51 and whether or not he is capable.

01:01:53 I believe it's some people's opinion

01:01:55 because their interest might have run in conflict with his.

01:01:59 That's just my take.

01:02:00 Right.

01:02:01 And then, I mean, yes, it seemed like I

01:02:03 was being a little fickle and wishy-washy.

01:02:04 But really, I can only call on the information that I have.

01:02:07 And also, I don't want to be the guy who's

01:02:08 dragging his feet in a take even though I have new information.

01:02:11 So it was the combination of, yes,

01:02:14 being reminded that there was talk about Mayo being

01:02:17 inexperienced and nothing really after that from anybody else

01:02:20 on top of the, OK, if you can get Vrabel and Adam Peters,

01:02:24 that's a pretty clear vision for the future.

01:02:26 I do like that.

01:02:27 But again, if the Crafts are saying, hey, we want Mayo,

01:02:29 clearly he must have presented or will be presenting them

01:02:32 a plan, hopefully, that gives them confidence to hire him.

01:02:35 If he's the head coach, I'm all for it.

01:02:37 Because again, I think that you do

01:02:38 want to keep a lot of the culture

01:02:40 and a lot of the especially defensive philosophies

01:02:42 and the knowledge of everything that goes on there

01:02:44 because they did really well.

01:02:46 And if this was a championship level offense,

01:02:48 the defense would have done its job

01:02:50 and they would have been really good in the playoffs,

01:02:52 I think, as well.

01:02:52 So yeah, I understand it seemed like a pretty

01:02:55 aggressive about face.

01:02:56 But now, if Mayo does have the support,

01:02:59 then I'm all for him because I really

01:03:01 do think that he's put in the time.

01:03:03 I think you do want to have that level of continuity.

01:03:05 And also, like I said earlier, it's not just Bill Jr.

01:03:08 He's a completely different person.

01:03:10 He talks different.

01:03:11 He acts differently.

01:03:13 Mark Daniels had a piece this morning talking

01:03:15 about Gerard Mayo's relationship with players

01:03:17 where he said Christian Barmore made fun of Mayo's hairline

01:03:20 and the fact he's going bald.

01:03:22 And then Mayo comes back, how are you big and fat

01:03:25 and you have skinny legs?

01:03:27 Just being able to-- and you know, obviously,

01:03:29 with your experience with him, Mayo is a people person.

01:03:32 So I'm excited about that, the idea

01:03:34 that you can keep the discipline and all the good things

01:03:37 about the Patriots culture, but also bring things

01:03:39 that I think people have wanted for a while

01:03:41 where there's a--

01:03:42 I'm not saying that Bill was inhumane.

01:03:44 I think that Bill was a better human being than people will

01:03:47 ever give him credit for.

01:03:48 But he also was still Phil Belichick,

01:03:50 and I think it'd be really cool to get somebody else.

01:03:52 Mayo's actually also brilliant.

01:03:55 There's a lot of people--

01:03:57 and actually, not like football smart, he's a brilliant dude.

01:04:03 People say this about players and ex-players and this

01:04:06 and that, like, oh, they could do anything.

01:04:08 I don't know that that's always the case.

01:04:11 But with Mayo, I think it absolutely is,

01:04:14 and he proved it.

01:04:15 He could just go and learn how to do anything.

01:04:17 If he wanted to start a new career tomorrow

01:04:20 on something he'd never even thought about doing, in a year,

01:04:22 he'd be successful at it.

01:04:23 That's the kind of guy he is.

01:04:25 That's the kind of guy he is.

01:04:26 He really is.

01:04:27 So there's something to be said for that,

01:04:30 like just having the smartest guy in the room.

01:04:33 But again, anybody who's ever done anything

01:04:36 for the first time, it's--

01:04:40 I'll tell you this as my own personal experience,

01:04:42 which can't in any way relate to running a professional football

01:04:49 organization, which is just insane,

01:04:52 the amount of attention to detail

01:04:54 and being able to connect and to relate and to study things

01:04:57 and to be on top of everything.

01:04:59 I think it's got to be one of the hardest jobs in America.

01:05:02 But I mean, things you can't possibly

01:05:04 know how to do until you do them.

01:05:06 Be a parent.

01:05:07 Holy crap, is that hard.

01:05:09 And you--

01:05:10 We were just talking about that.

01:05:11 OK, number one.

01:05:12 Number two, when I became a teacher, I was like,

01:05:15 I know what I'm talking about.

01:05:17 And then I'm like, I don't know what I'm doing here.

01:05:19 And I think they know it.

01:05:21 That's another thing.

01:05:22 Being a boss, being in charge of people, it's hard.

01:05:25 In anything, I managed-- first managerial job

01:05:28 was managing a staff of three.

01:05:29 And I almost had a mutiny.

01:05:31 I was like, oh, this is crazy.

01:05:34 It's so hard to do these things.

01:05:36 Being a beat reporter.

01:05:37 No, it's crazy.

01:05:39 It's-- there's-- sure, absolutely.

01:05:41 You're like, you're there.

01:05:42 And you're like, I want to do everything.

01:05:43 But there's only one of me.

01:05:44 So no matter what you're doing, when you're in a position

01:05:47 where you've got to make decisions

01:05:48 and people are looking to you to figure that stuff out,

01:05:51 it's really, really hard.

01:05:53 So that experience, I think-- but that's how it works, right?

01:05:57 Like, you take the philosophy and you take the mind

01:06:00 and you recognize that there's going to be lumps along the way

01:06:03 and you figure it out.

01:06:04 And that's just how it works.

01:06:05 Otherwise, there'd never be assistance

01:06:07 elevated to head coaches.

01:06:09 I like the idea of doing it.

01:06:10 I mean, look, my leading candidate, based off of nothing,

01:06:13 is like a Ben Johnson candidate because I want--

01:06:15 I want that new wave of thinking.

01:06:18 I want the taste of the McDaniels and the McVeigh

01:06:22 thing that's going on, where they're--

01:06:24 as innovative as Bill Belichick was in everything that he did,

01:06:27 particularly defense, you see which way the league has moved.

01:06:29 I want an unproven assistant with a crazy offensive brain

01:06:35 to be one of the people who's considered here.

01:06:37 So I'm not going to discount Mayo just

01:06:38 for the lack of experience.

01:06:40 But it is a really, really hard thing.

01:06:41 So I understand why "Dakota" or "Reports"

01:06:45 might have been like, not sure if they're ready.

01:06:47 You're not sure if anybody is ready, right?

01:06:49 You're not sure if anybody-- when Brandon Staley jumped

01:06:51 into the job, everyone's like, this was a great hire,

01:06:55 and this guy's going to be awesome.

01:06:57 A lot of people--

01:06:58 [INAUDIBLE]

01:06:59 And no, it wasn't.

01:07:00 You see it go a lot of ways.

01:07:02 You never know how it's going to turn out until you're--

01:07:05 You went from being a press conference darling

01:07:08 and saying all the right things to getting snippy

01:07:09 with reporters.

01:07:10 And it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, this guy

01:07:12 is starting to lose it a little bit.

01:07:13 No, it's true, though.

01:07:15 It's the Tyson quote.

01:07:17 Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.

01:07:21 It's challenging.

01:07:22 So whoever it is, whoever comes in

01:07:24 is going to have their work cut out for them for sure.

01:07:27 Want to give a shout out to Jimmy Toscano, who's apparently

01:07:30 just waking up and has entered the chat in there

01:07:34 from the "Garden Report," but also a guy who's

01:07:37 covered the Patriots for a bit.

01:07:39 Jimmy and I were out in Arizona for the Seattle Super Bowl,

01:07:44 which to my--

01:07:46 I'm still going to contend--

01:07:48 and I was at 28-3 also, and obviously you

01:07:50 have the first one--

01:07:51 the single greatest game, pound for pound,

01:07:54 Super Bowl that the Patriots played in.

01:07:56 And that's factoring in a 28-3 comeback and two

01:08:00 last second field goals.

01:08:02 I still am putting that Seattle Super Bowl as the best played

01:08:05 Super Bowl I've ever seen in my life with an ending

01:08:08 that I don't think people still give enough credit to.

01:08:12 You're flipping win probability by 99% in one play.

01:08:16 It's the single greatest play in a championship game of all time.

01:08:21 And that's-- it's still going to--

01:08:24 People act like it was a fluke.

01:08:25 They were like, oh, P. Carroll made a bad decision.

01:08:27 It was literally a play they specifically

01:08:29 practiced knowing-- also, as a football nerd,

01:08:32 I'm telling you, you almost never

01:08:34 see that play get intercepted.

01:08:35 It literally is either you catch it or it bounces off

01:08:37 or you let it down.

01:08:38 It was insane.

01:08:39 Malcolm got lit up in practice over and over and over again.

01:08:43 He couldn't get over on it.

01:08:45 They couldn't get there.

01:08:46 And obviously, you're going to give--

01:08:50 who was the Seattle Legion of Boom guy, the safety Jesus,

01:08:53 I'm blanking with a B, who blew up the play.

01:08:56 Oh, Browner.

01:08:57 Brendan Browner.

01:08:58 He blew up the stack.

01:08:59 If he doesn't blow that up in such an amazing manner,

01:09:03 Malcolm might not be able to slip through and make the pick.

01:09:06 And again, we might have to add this to your top 10 list.

01:09:09 Two of my favorite words in Patriots history

01:09:15 is Malcolm, go.

01:09:18 Because they knew it.

01:09:19 As soon as it got to that down and they said, here it is.

01:09:23 We're doing it.

01:09:25 They knew, Taylor.

01:09:27 And Malcolm, go.

01:09:28 And he flies out there.

01:09:30 Oh, my goodness gracious.

01:09:32 Best thing I've ever seen.

01:09:33 It killed me not having that on the list.

01:09:35 It really did.

01:09:36 I was tough.

01:09:37 Brian Flores.

01:09:38 Brian Flores.

01:09:39 Three quarters, three.

01:09:41 Malcolm, go.

01:09:42 Malcolm, go.

01:09:42 Oh, my god.

01:09:44 Gives me chills.

01:09:45 That was fanboy sort of stuff.

01:09:50 That was pretty amazing.

01:09:52 Guys, we're going to wrap it up.

01:09:53 This is the beginning of our coverage and not the end.

01:09:55 We already have a couple of written pieces

01:09:57 out on CLS Media.

01:09:58 We're going to be at the press conference.

01:09:59 We're going to try to bring it to you live

01:10:00 or turn it around for you as quickly as possible,

01:10:03 depending on the setup over there.

01:10:04 So you can check that out.

01:10:05 Then Taylor's going to have a bunch of stuff and standups

01:10:08 throughout the day.

01:10:09 You can guarantee on Patriots PressFaster

01:10:11 will be a bunch of podcasts, breaking news podcasts,

01:10:15 possibly some more live stuff, as all of our fleet

01:10:18 of Patriots contributors are going

01:10:21 to have their say about what is an incredibly historic

01:10:25 and I think sad day--

01:10:29 not I think, a sad day where it is the end of an era,

01:10:33 the ending of things, even if they needed to end.

01:10:38 You're always going to look back on what it was.

01:10:40 And what it was was unbelievable and special.

01:10:42 And as Taylor had pointed out, the reason

01:10:45 he became a sports fan, the reason he does what he does,

01:10:48 it's probably defined a lot of your identities.

01:10:52 As people and fans out there in the chat,

01:10:55 your entire personality and all of your life choices

01:10:58 honestly might have been shaped by the level of sports fan

01:11:03 being a Patriots fan through the 2000s has made you.

01:11:07 So I really do think it's a profound impact on all

01:11:13 of our lives in such a positive way

01:11:15 that you're going to have to kind of take that back seat,

01:11:19 take a step back and celebrate what this is

01:11:22 and recognize how special it was.

01:11:24 We do get caught up a little bit in the,

01:11:26 he can't draft, and have the torches at the door about this

01:11:30 and that.

01:11:30 But now that it's done, you're right.

01:11:32 The feeling is a little bit weird.

01:11:34 And what happens next is going to be super interesting.

01:11:38 Franchise is in a place it hasn't been in a long time,

01:11:40 which is at the bottom, needing a lot of everything

01:11:44 with an extremely high draft pick.

01:11:45 And things are going to be totally different coming back

01:11:49 here.

01:11:50 So again, like I said, a lot of remembrance, but also a lot of--

01:11:56 it's going to be the next few decisions.

01:11:59 You're not going to know if they're right or wrong

01:12:01 for a really long time.

01:12:02 And everyone's going to have an opinion.

01:12:03 But every single thing that happens from this moment

01:12:06 forward, Taylor, is going to be really interesting.

01:12:10 Every single thing.

01:12:13 And I'll tell you this.

01:12:14 We're all wrong.

01:12:15 Everything we think we want, we have no idea.

01:12:18 I'll say my first of a zillion bad takes in history,

01:12:23 and I've had a zillion of them.

01:12:25 But my first and worst was Bledsoe over Brady.

01:12:29 I wanted Bledsoe to get his job back.

01:12:31 It is what it is.

01:12:33 The camp was remarkably split back then.

01:12:35 I don't know if people recognize or remember it.

01:12:37 When Brady got hurt in the AFC title game--

01:12:38 Which made sense.

01:12:39 Brady got hurt in the AFC title game.

01:12:41 Bledsoe came in and helped them win it.

01:12:43 A lot of people wanted him to start the Super Bowl.

01:12:46 So what you want is not always what necessarily

01:12:50 needs to happen.

01:12:51 But I do think there is a general level of agreement

01:12:55 among people who either hated Bill all along

01:12:58 or loved him that this is probably the right decision

01:13:01 for the franchise.

01:13:02 Yep, I agree.

01:13:05 It had to happen at some point.

01:13:07 Again, Bill's own philosophy.

01:13:08 Move on a year early, then a year late.

01:13:10 And at the end of the day, that really is what this is.

01:13:13 You can disagree.

01:13:14 I mean, everybody, I think, agrees that Bill is still

01:13:16 a good head coach.

01:13:17 But it also reports came out from ESPN

01:13:20 that they parted ways.

01:13:22 It was mutual, and it was respectful,

01:13:23 and that it was a healthy divorce.

01:13:26 So I mean, you got to be happy with that.

01:13:28 At least both sides got to go out on relatively

01:13:30 their own terms.

01:13:31 Yeah, and again, as Bill would say famously, with everything,

01:13:34 you said the year early rather than a year late.

01:13:36 And also, just the way it goes with the Patriots organization

01:13:39 is we're on to blank.

01:13:41 Whatever is on to next is now the most important thing.

01:13:44 And there's a lot of important decisions to be made.

01:13:47 So we'll see.

01:13:47 As the day comes on, and I'll let you guys know as well,

01:13:51 we will do our best to try and immediately react

01:13:54 to any significant Patriots news,

01:13:57 but not necessarily every single rumor that's out there.

01:14:00 So if there's something definitive on the coaching

01:14:02 search, we'll jump back up here live

01:14:04 as soon as we're able to assemble.

01:14:07 But in the meantime, Taylor's got to hit the--

01:14:11 he's got to--

01:14:12 Big day.

01:14:13 He's got to head out to Gillette and see what happens.

01:14:15 So again, they're talking together.

01:14:18 I'm curious what side of Bill we see.

01:14:20 This is one of the most interesting press conferences,

01:14:23 I think, ever.

01:14:24 The all-timers post-Deflategate, post-Aaron Hernandez.

01:14:29 And right now, what type of tone is he going to strike?

01:14:34 Was it really-- is he annoyed?

01:14:37 Is he mad?

01:14:37 Did he not want this?

01:14:38 Did he get it too?

01:14:40 Is he going to be reflective?

01:14:41 Is he going to be open?

01:14:42 Is he going to be combative?

01:14:43 Is he going to own up to some stuff?

01:14:45 Is he going to admit to any mistakes?

01:14:47 Is he going to show a human side?

01:14:49 Is he going to let his hair down, so to speak?

01:14:51 I'm really, really curious to see.

01:14:52 I think he's going to be very open.

01:14:54 I think he's going to be very open.

01:14:55 I think he's going to be very open.

01:14:57 I think he's going to be very open.

01:14:58 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:00 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:01 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:03 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:04 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:05 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:07 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:08 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:10 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:11 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:13 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:14 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:16 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:17 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:19 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:20 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:22 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:23 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:25 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:26 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:28 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:29 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:31 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:32 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:34 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:35 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:37 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:38 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:40 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:41 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:43 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:44 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:46 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:47 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:49 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:50 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:52 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:53 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:55 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:56 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:58 I think he's going to be very open.

01:15:59 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:01 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:02 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:04 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:05 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:07 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:08 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:10 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:11 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:13 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:14 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:16 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:17 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:19 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:21 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:23 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:25 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:27 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:29 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:31 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:33 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:35 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:37 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:39 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:41 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:43 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:45 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:47 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:49 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:51 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:53 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:55 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:57 I think he's going to be very open.

01:16:59 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:01 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:03 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:05 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:07 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:09 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:11 I think he's going to be very open.

01:17:13 I think he's going to be very open.

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